4 ms·

Sorry I don't get the USP of this. Can someone explain what's the best of both worlds that is being offered here? Thanks!

hardwaresofton 6y ago
The write-once-run-everywhere promise -- Flutter is really good at multi-platform support because it works at the pixel level. So in a browser/web context, all you need (roughly) is a canvas, and to compile the relevant Dart to JS and you're off to the races.
- hdsikeks 6y ago
  Can you give an example of a flutter app people use by choice outside of android? I think my google wifi app uses it and that's about it, and the google wifi app is not exactly the picture of quality software. The framework seems designed to hold the hand of android developers, not to provide a decent experience to the end user. I have no clue why people keep referencing it as some kind of working cross-platform solution when it clearly caters exclusively to android.
  - nmcain 6y ago
    Flutter's team is making efforts to improve it on other platforms, iirc it powers Stadia, and the new Google iOT hardware like the Home Hub (or whever they are calling that now) and the new Google TV.
- nmcain 6y ago
  Not to mention some of the best touch gesture support on Linux I have seen so far, one of the benefits of it being a mobile platform ig
- happymellon 6y ago
  But thats just Flutter, and it can already run on Linux. What is the benefit of Fuchia?
  - stragies 6y ago
    Possibility to (re-)introduce binary_only, closed_source hw driver modules for the fuchsia kernel? And still get to use all the goodie from GPL userland.
    - happymellon 6y ago
      When I looked up Fucia and saw that it was Apache licenced, I assumed it was probably because Google are tired of providing back to the community that gave it 99% of the code that it uses. Much easier to do an Apple and take other people's work and not share back when it's not GPL'ed.
- SahAssar 6y ago
  If everything is just run as a canvas then you also loose everything that is good about a platform like accessibility, index-ability (at least on the web), integration with platform tools like copy, selecting text and so, so much more. I can see canvas rendering as a good target for games and for individual components such as a drawing surface or a chart but using it for a whole app is just throwing out the baby with the bathwater.
  - jamesgeck0 6y ago
    Flutter on the web is more complicated than just a canvas element. The project has a fair amount of effort put into a11y on mobile; I’d be really surprised if the web output isn’t also accessible.
    - SahAssar 6y ago
      Picking the first demo on https://gallery.flutter.dev https://gallery.flutter.dev : https://gallery.flutter.dev/#/reply https://gallery.flutter.dev/#/reply It seems like it renders text via a SVG on top of a canvas layer that is the background, so that's a plus for a11y. As for the downsides, and I'm not sure how much this is due to flutter or the app itself: * I can't use the browser search for elements outside the viewport * I can't select text at all * I can't tab through elements/links at all (which is often seen as a strong indicator of bad a11y) * Browser back/forward do not work as expected (back exits the app completely, and then forward does not bring me back) The second demo there: https://gallery.flutter.dev/#/shrine https://gallery.flutter.dev/#/shrine * All the same as the first one, but also clickable elements do not give me any feedback that they are clickable (hand-pointer cursour or any underline/similar effect) --- Maybe these are just demos that have not thought of these specific things but since it is a web showcase of a framework meant to work on the web (although not exclusively) and these were the first links up there it's a bit disappointing. My point is that you get most of these things for free (or easy) on the normal web, but flutter seems to try to patch them back onto it instead of using what is there.
      - jamesgeck0 6y ago
lupinglade 6y ago
To me this looks like the worst of both worlds. Poor UI choice, poor apps and loss of Linux hardware support. Sorry to be negative, but I just don't see where this fits.

hardwaresofton 6y ago

The write-once-run-everywhere promise -- Flutter is really good at multi-platform support because it works at the pixel level. So in a browser/web context, all you need (roughly) is a canvas, and to compile the relevant Dart to JS and you're off to the races.

hdsikeks 6y ago
Can you give an example of a flutter app people use by choice outside of android? I think my google wifi app uses it and that's about it, and the google wifi app is not exactly the picture of quality software. The framework seems designed to hold the hand of android developers, not to provide a decent experience to the end user. I have no clue why people keep referencing it as some kind of working cross-platform solution when it clearly caters exclusively to android.
- nmcain 6y ago
  Flutter's team is making efforts to improve it on other platforms, iirc it powers Stadia, and the new Google iOT hardware like the Home Hub (or whever they are calling that now) and the new Google TV.
nmcain 6y ago
Not to mention some of the best touch gesture support on Linux I have seen so far, one of the benefits of it being a mobile platform ig
happymellon 6y ago
But thats just Flutter, and it can already run on Linux. What is the benefit of Fuchia?
- stragies 6y ago
  Possibility to (re-)introduce binary_only, closed_source hw driver modules for the fuchsia kernel? And still get to use all the goodie from GPL userland.
  - happymellon 6y ago
    When I looked up Fucia and saw that it was Apache licenced, I assumed it was probably because Google are tired of providing back to the community that gave it 99% of the code that it uses. Much easier to do an Apple and take other people's work and not share back when it's not GPL'ed.
SahAssar 6y ago
If everything is just run as a canvas then you also loose everything that is good about a platform like accessibility, index-ability (at least on the web), integration with platform tools like copy, selecting text and so, so much more. I can see canvas rendering as a good target for games and for individual components such as a drawing surface or a chart but using it for a whole app is just throwing out the baby with the bathwater.
- jamesgeck0 6y ago
  Flutter on the web is more complicated than just a canvas element. The project has a fair amount of effort put into a11y on mobile; I’d be really surprised if the web output isn’t also accessible.
  - SahAssar 6y ago
    Picking the first demo on https://gallery.flutter.dev https://gallery.flutter.dev : https://gallery.flutter.dev/#/reply https://gallery.flutter.dev/#/reply It seems like it renders text via a SVG on top of a canvas layer that is the background, so that's a plus for a11y. As for the downsides, and I'm not sure how much this is due to flutter or the app itself: * I can't use the browser search for elements outside the viewport * I can't select text at all * I can't tab through elements/links at all (which is often seen as a strong indicator of bad a11y) * Browser back/forward do not work as expected (back exits the app completely, and then forward does not bring me back) The second demo there: https://gallery.flutter.dev/#/shrine https://gallery.flutter.dev/#/shrine * All the same as the first one, but also clickable elements do not give me any feedback that they are clickable (hand-pointer cursour or any underline/similar effect) --- Maybe these are just demos that have not thought of these specific things but since it is a web showcase of a framework meant to work on the web (although not exclusively) and these were the first links up there it's a bit disappointing. My point is that you get most of these things for free (or easy) on the normal web, but flutter seems to try to patch them back onto it instead of using what is there.
    - jamesgeck0 6y ago

lupinglade 6y ago

To me this looks like the worst of both worlds. Poor UI choice, poor apps and loss of Linux hardware support. Sorry to be negative, but I just don't see where this fits.