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> They think (correctly imo) people will like taxes less if they're hellishly complicated to file. Their actual argument is that we should simplify the code it

> They think (correctly imo) people will like taxes less if they're hellishly complicated to file. Their actual argument is that we should simplify the code itself, not try and hide its complexity from the payers using some computer system only available to the IRS. They do think that you should have to file every year though, that is correct. That forces a bit of visibility and accountability on the government in that it shows people just how much they're working for the government before working for themselves. This is similar to how the US makes sales tax visible to the payer, rather than hiding them behind an invisible VAT. It's about transparency.

vkou 6y ago
> They do think that you should have to file every year though, that is correct. That forces a bit of visibility and accountability on the government in that it shows people just how much they're working for the government before working for themselves. People would know this if they'd just get a tax bill sent to them. Believe me, people who live in countries where filing your taxes occupies ~5-minutes of brainspace per year aren't ignorant children. They know how much they are paying.
girvo 6y ago
There is zero difference in transparency between my calculating what taxes will be added to the sticker price, or my calculating what taxes were added to the sticker price (here in Aus). In fact the latter is easier.
mattkrause 6y ago
I'm not sure that's Intuit's actual argument: https://www.propublica.org/article/inside-turbotax-20-year-fight-to-stop-americans-from-filing-their-taxes-for-free https://www.propublica.org/article/inside-turbotax-20-year-f...
realityking 6y ago
> This is similar to how the US makes sales tax visible to the payer, rather than hiding them behind an invisible VAT. It's about transparency. Here in Germany, and I believe in all of Europe, every single invoice and receipt I’ve ever received includes both the gross and the net price. It has to because of how VAT can be deducted for business expenses. Similarly my monthly pay slip spells out exactly how much I’ve paid this month for income tax, church tax, solidarity tax (this one is related to the German reunification), health insurance, retirements insurance and unemployment insurance. It also includes how much I’ve in the year up to today. Nothing is hidden and most folks know very well how much they’re paying at least in aggregate. We just don’t make it difficult to pay.

vkou 6y ago

> They do think that you should have to file every year though, that is correct. That forces a bit of visibility and accountability on the government in that it shows people just how much they're working for the government before working for themselves. People would know this if they'd just get a tax bill sent to them. Believe me, people who live in countries where filing your taxes occupies ~5-minutes of brainspace per year aren't ignorant children. They know how much they are paying.

girvo 6y ago

There is zero difference in transparency between my calculating what taxes will be added to the sticker price, or my calculating what taxes were added to the sticker price (here in Aus). In fact the latter is easier.

mattkrause 6y ago

I'm not sure that's Intuit's actual argument: https://www.propublica.org/article/inside-turbotax-20-year-fight-to-stop-americans-from-filing-their-taxes-for-free https://www.propublica.org/article/inside-turbotax-20-year-f...

realityking 6y ago

> This is similar to how the US makes sales tax visible to the payer, rather than hiding them behind an invisible VAT. It's about transparency. Here in Germany, and I believe in all of Europe, every single invoice and receipt I’ve ever received includes both the gross and the net price. It has to because of how VAT can be deducted for business expenses. Similarly my monthly pay slip spells out exactly how much I’ve paid this month for income tax, church tax, solidarity tax (this one is related to the German reunification), health insurance, retirements insurance and unemployment insurance. It also includes how much I’ve in the year up to today. Nothing is hidden and most folks know very well how much they’re paying at least in aggregate. We just don’t make it difficult to pay.