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That's one more person freed from having to point a camera at a ball for 90 minutes a week, free to find more fulfilling work! Perhaps the camera operator's ne

That's one more person freed from having to point a camera at a ball for 90 minutes a week, free to find more fulfilling work! Perhaps the camera operator's new work could be sitting in a comfy chair, tuning the areas of interest and motion profiles of a dozen cameras around the stadium to find the best angle on the action, allowing them to track smoothly under servos, pausing for a minute to think about the pacing of the game and what plays might develop, instead of mindlessly following the ball from place to place. I'm an automation engineer, I've worked with hundreds of machine operators. They're almost universally happier after their employer gives them a better tool with which to do the work. The jobs that automated/AI equipment is replacing are not good jobs. Performing the same task for 90 minutes, much less an 8 hour shift, is awful on the body, and even worse on the mind. Humans don't make great robots, and it's not great to ask a human do a job that should be done by a robot.

ddevault 6y ago
Yeah, that's not how it works. That's how you want to believe it works so you can sleep at night. In reality that person probably turned to the gig economy, with no job security, benefits, or upwards mobility, and works twice as much to put less money into savings.
- buzzerbetrayed 6y ago
  I love how you’re just completely making up this very specific scenario at this point.
gentleman11 6y ago
> Performing the same task for 90 minutes, much less an 8 hour shift, is awful on the body, and even worse on the mind. Humans don't make great robots, and it's not great to ask a human do a job that should be done by a robot. Then you have to take the next step and ask: why do they do it? If it’s tedious, unsatisfying, lacks prestige, and is utterly demoralizing, what possible reason could somebody have to do it? Either the worker is insane, or else...
- Smoofer 6y ago
  Bro people need money
  - vincnetas 6y ago
    Exactly. And these people are usually automated out, not moved to some other position. And if they were working this non exiting job before, what guarantees they have thet after automation they magically will land an interesting and fulfilling role.
    - tupputuppu 6y ago
      Well one guarantee is - according to scientific consensus - that this exact same process has been working for the last 200 years, and previously people have always gotten better jobs and a higher standard of living. You think the people working farm jobs or sweatshops had better opportunities at the time their jobs were automated away?
      - Viliam1234 6y ago
        The difference is that 200 years ago, most work was physically challenging but intellectually simple. When some of those jobs were replaced by jobs that were easier physically but more challenging intellectually, we got different opportunities for different people. Today would be analogical if we had a population of people with average IQ 150, locked in jobs that require IQ 100. By automating those jobs away, we would open new opportunities that would fit people better. But instead, we have a world where the average IQ is 100, and the standard advice for people who lose their jobs is "learn to code". So we get the situation where some people are unable to find a job, and other people are pushed to work overtime... and we cannot balance it by hiring the former into job positions of the latter. (Also, historically speaking, many people starved to death when their farms were taken away. The new jobs appeared later, but it took some time.)
  - gentleman11 6y ago
    That was the fill in the blank answer I was hinting at. They don’t have a better prospect, and that they can only choose from a weaker or more complicated/risky set of options after losing their current job
inimino 6y ago
Are you serious? People are concerned about the loss of jobs due to the software our industry creates, and your response is to imagine a completely made-up scenario where that person gets a new, more fulfilling job that you literally just made up in your own head? By the way, is that your idea of an ideal job for everyone? Sitting in a "comfy chair", rather than doing, you know, the actual job of a cameraman, a job that is arguably an art form in itself? Do you understand that people love sports, people actually enjoy the athleticism of running around with cameras documenting sports, and that what you're dismissing would be a dream job for many people? Do you really truly think the people buying this technology are doing it so that they can also continue to pay that same person to sit in a room and control it, while working towards self-actualization?? And do you think the appropriate response to concerns over jobs being eliminated is that the newly unemployed should feel grateful for being "freed" from the work they loved and took pride in, to go and do something "more fulfilling"? And add insult to injury by telling them that the job they had was just not a good job and wasn't something humans should have been doing in the first place? > I'm an automation engineer, I've worked with hundreds of machine operators. You mean, the ones that are keeping their jobs? Have you spent just as much time with the ones whose jobs have been eliminated? I mean, I can understand that you may be facing a little cognitive dissonance here due to your job, but ... try to show a tiny bit of empathy for your fellow human. You think AI won't be able to do your job someday? Are you totally comfortable being dropped onto the labor market in today's economy if your current professional skill set became entirely valueless overnight, or is that something you only expect other people to be OK with? We are recreating and eliminating entire industries, jobs, and traditions, and the level of awareness and respect for that disruption needs to dialed up by several orders of magnitude, or we as an industry, and all of us as a society, are in for some serious trouble.
- poisonborz 6y ago
  Why do you just think of cameraman jobs? Here, one industry (AI, object tracking) replaces another (cameraman). I would make the wild guess that this creates more jobs than it eliminates (because tech is not yet perfect or sometimes not applicable). The nature of human professions change all the time. Brickmakers or coopers also took pride in their profession. In the future, being a football match cameraman might just as well not be the best way to provide a useful service to others.
dragonwriter 6y ago
> The jobs that automated/AI equipment is replacing are not good jobs. Most jobs in the world are not good jobs, sure. But unless you also take money from the capitalists and elite laborers enriched by automation to provide stronger social safety nets, automating away demand for low-skill crap jobs while making the fewer remaining jobs both better and higher paying means increasing the prevalence of the worst human misery. People might hate crap jobs, but not as much as they hate being qualified for no job in a capitalist society.
- GFischer 6y ago
  So change the freaking society as well... I've ran for the equivalent of Congress in my country, and even got elected as a substitute, and sent 3 draft bills for consideration. It has better safety nets than the U.S. I feel I'm doing my part, unfortunately my work is automating work in the U.S., not in my country.
  - iso1631 6y ago
    90% turnout is amazing, is it a legal obligation to vote?
    - GFischer 6y ago
      Yes, unless you're infirm and you have to give a medical reason. And it has bite, you get your wages garnished if you didn't vote, unless you pay a hefty fine.

ddevault 6y ago

Yeah, that's not how it works. That's how you want to believe it works so you can sleep at night. In reality that person probably turned to the gig economy, with no job security, benefits, or upwards mobility, and works twice as much to put less money into savings.

buzzerbetrayed 6y ago
I love how you’re just completely making up this very specific scenario at this point.

gentleman11 6y ago

> Performing the same task for 90 minutes, much less an 8 hour shift, is awful on the body, and even worse on the mind. Humans don't make great robots, and it's not great to ask a human do a job that should be done by a robot. Then you have to take the next step and ask: why do they do it? If it’s tedious, unsatisfying, lacks prestige, and is utterly demoralizing, what possible reason could somebody have to do it? Either the worker is insane, or else...

Smoofer 6y ago
Bro people need money
- vincnetas 6y ago
  Exactly. And these people are usually automated out, not moved to some other position. And if they were working this non exiting job before, what guarantees they have thet after automation they magically will land an interesting and fulfilling role.
  - tupputuppu 6y ago
    Well one guarantee is - according to scientific consensus - that this exact same process has been working for the last 200 years, and previously people have always gotten better jobs and a higher standard of living. You think the people working farm jobs or sweatshops had better opportunities at the time their jobs were automated away?
    - Viliam1234 6y ago
      The difference is that 200 years ago, most work was physically challenging but intellectually simple. When some of those jobs were replaced by jobs that were easier physically but more challenging intellectually, we got different opportunities for different people. Today would be analogical if we had a population of people with average IQ 150, locked in jobs that require IQ 100. By automating those jobs away, we would open new opportunities that would fit people better. But instead, we have a world where the average IQ is 100, and the standard advice for people who lose their jobs is "learn to code". So we get the situation where some people are unable to find a job, and other people are pushed to work overtime... and we cannot balance it by hiring the former into job positions of the latter. (Also, historically speaking, many people starved to death when their farms were taken away. The new jobs appeared later, but it took some time.)
- gentleman11 6y ago
  That was the fill in the blank answer I was hinting at. They don’t have a better prospect, and that they can only choose from a weaker or more complicated/risky set of options after losing their current job

inimino 6y ago

Are you serious? People are concerned about the loss of jobs due to the software our industry creates, and your response is to imagine a completely made-up scenario where that person gets a new, more fulfilling job that you literally just made up in your own head? By the way, is that your idea of an ideal job for everyone? Sitting in a "comfy chair", rather than doing, you know, the actual job of a cameraman, a job that is arguably an art form in itself? Do you understand that people love sports, people actually enjoy the athleticism of running around with cameras documenting sports, and that what you're dismissing would be a dream job for many people? Do you really truly think the people buying this technology are doing it so that they can also continue to pay that same person to sit in a room and control it, while working towards self-actualization?? And do you think the appropriate response to concerns over jobs being eliminated is that the newly unemployed should feel grateful for being "freed" from the work they loved and took pride in, to go and do something "more fulfilling"? And add insult to injury by telling them that the job they had was just not a good job and wasn't something humans should have been doing in the first place? > I'm an automation engineer, I've worked with hundreds of machine operators. You mean, the ones that are keeping their jobs? Have you spent just as much time with the ones whose jobs have been eliminated? I mean, I can understand that you may be facing a little cognitive dissonance here due to your job, but ... try to show a tiny bit of empathy for your fellow human. You think AI won't be able to do your job someday? Are you totally comfortable being dropped onto the labor market in today's economy if your current professional skill set became entirely valueless overnight, or is that something you only expect other people to be OK with? We are recreating and eliminating entire industries, jobs, and traditions, and the level of awareness and respect for that disruption needs to dialed up by several orders of magnitude, or we as an industry, and all of us as a society, are in for some serious trouble.

poisonborz 6y ago
Why do you just think of cameraman jobs? Here, one industry (AI, object tracking) replaces another (cameraman). I would make the wild guess that this creates more jobs than it eliminates (because tech is not yet perfect or sometimes not applicable). The nature of human professions change all the time. Brickmakers or coopers also took pride in their profession. In the future, being a football match cameraman might just as well not be the best way to provide a useful service to others.

dragonwriter 6y ago

> The jobs that automated/AI equipment is replacing are not good jobs. Most jobs in the world are not good jobs, sure. But unless you also take money from the capitalists and elite laborers enriched by automation to provide stronger social safety nets, automating away demand for low-skill crap jobs while making the fewer remaining jobs both better and higher paying means increasing the prevalence of the worst human misery. People might hate crap jobs, but not as much as they hate being qualified for no job in a capitalist society.

GFischer 6y ago
So change the freaking society as well... I've ran for the equivalent of Congress in my country, and even got elected as a substitute, and sent 3 draft bills for consideration. It has better safety nets than the U.S. I feel I'm doing my part, unfortunately my work is automating work in the U.S., not in my country.
- iso1631 6y ago
  90% turnout is amazing, is it a legal obligation to vote?
  - GFischer 6y ago
    Yes, unless you're infirm and you have to give a medical reason. And it has bite, you get your wages garnished if you didn't vote, unless you pay a hefty fine.