4 ms·

It's like saying you own the "business" behind the restaurant -- brand and so forth -- even if you're renting the space. It's kind of like how you own the asse

It's like saying you own the "business" behind the restaurant -- brand and so forth -- even if you're renting the space. It's kind of like how you own the assets in your bank account and have a right to the returns on them even though the building, the accounting software, the IP and internal best practices supporting it are all (usually) owned by the bank. We need to recognize the property interest of users in what they built -- in their content, following, online store, &c -- as a separate matter from the from the platform's ownership of its infrastructure, best practices and organization.

Nasrudith 6y ago
Bank accounts already have contracts and terms regulated for the actual legal obligations. We "need" nothing else for shouts to the void as nobody gives enough of a shit to set up and use more guaranteed terms and any arguments are just as timely, sane, and useful as saying we need to make blood oaths legally binding and have notaries for them. No we don't we really don't.
- solidsnack9000 6y ago
  The terms we "already" have for bank accounts are due to a long interplay between consumers, banks, and regulators.
krapp 6y ago
Except, even if you do own the assets in your bank account (I've seen a lot of sources claiming that, at least in the US, you don't but I have no idea how accurate that is) you still signed a contract with regard to that account, agreeing to abide by certain terms including rates and fees. And on every social media platform with which you have an account, you agreed to terms of service which very likely grant the platform a "worldwide, non-exclusive, royalty-free license (with the right to sublicense) to use, copy, reproduce, process, adapt, modify, publish, transmit, display and distribute such content in any and all media or distribution methods now known or later developed." (copied from Twitter's TOS, but every other platform is basically the same.) data and infrastructure are not separate matters. Just as, with a bank, your account is a liability unless it makes them money, with a social media platform your data is a liability unless it makes them money. And in exchange for a free platform (or free checking and a pen) you gave certain rights of ownership away. If you want to "recognize the property interest of users" you have to recognize it in that context.
- solidsnack9000 6y ago
  The terms we of bank accounts are not merely the generous offerings of the banks, but the result of a long process of interplay between consumers, banks, and regulators. The ToS we have for online service providers doesn't recognize enough of the users' interests to counterbalance the power and interests of the major platforms.

Nasrudith 6y ago

Bank accounts already have contracts and terms regulated for the actual legal obligations. We "need" nothing else for shouts to the void as nobody gives enough of a shit to set up and use more guaranteed terms and any arguments are just as timely, sane, and useful as saying we need to make blood oaths legally binding and have notaries for them. No we don't we really don't.

solidsnack9000 6y ago
The terms we "already" have for bank accounts are due to a long interplay between consumers, banks, and regulators.

krapp 6y ago

Except, even if you do own the assets in your bank account (I've seen a lot of sources claiming that, at least in the US, you don't but I have no idea how accurate that is) you still signed a contract with regard to that account, agreeing to abide by certain terms including rates and fees. And on every social media platform with which you have an account, you agreed to terms of service which very likely grant the platform a "worldwide, non-exclusive, royalty-free license (with the right to sublicense) to use, copy, reproduce, process, adapt, modify, publish, transmit, display and distribute such content in any and all media or distribution methods now known or later developed." (copied from Twitter's TOS, but every other platform is basically the same.) data and infrastructure are not separate matters. Just as, with a bank, your account is a liability unless it makes them money, with a social media platform your data is a liability unless it makes them money. And in exchange for a free platform (or free checking and a pen) you gave certain rights of ownership away. If you want to "recognize the property interest of users" you have to recognize it in that context.

solidsnack9000 6y ago
The terms we of bank accounts are not merely the generous offerings of the banks, but the result of a long process of interplay between consumers, banks, and regulators. The ToS we have for online service providers doesn't recognize enough of the users' interests to counterbalance the power and interests of the major platforms.