4 ms·

I'd be more interested in hearing about how people trying to move money out of governments and areas affects local real estate prices. I think Canada has more

I'd be more interested in hearing about how people trying to move money out of governments and areas affects local real estate prices. I think Canada has more of a problem with wealthy Chinese trying to park their money outside of China than money laundering.

cool_dude85 6y ago
As mentioned in the article, evading capital controls is money laundering.
- valuearb 6y ago
  Let’s not conflate fleeing an oppressive regime with actual crimes.
  - mtnGoat 6y ago
    Crime is crime, let's not excuse it. You follow the laws of the country you are in regardless of circumstances in your past, coming from oppressive regime isn't a free ticket.
    - valuearb 6y ago
      What Canadian laws are being violated?
      - seemack 6y ago
        Laundering proceeds of crime - https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C-46/section-462.31.html https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C-46/section-462.31...
        valuearb 6y ago
        From your link: “(a) the commission in Canada of a designated offence; or (b) an act or omission anywhere that, if it had occurred in Canada, would have constituted a designated offence.” I wasn’t aware Canada had a $50,000 limit on moving funds from China.
        seemack 6y ago
        The premise here is evading capital controls. It seems like that would be a crime in Canada.
        valuearb 6y ago
        It isn’t. Free countries don’t enforce the laws of oppressive regimes for them.
  - buzzerbetrayed 6y ago
    This is the second time you've said basically this same thing in this thread. I want to know your reasoning. In your mind, how does living in an oppressive regime allow you to blatantly disobey the law in another, non-oppressive regime.
    - valuearb 6y ago
      Because they aren’t violating Canadian laws. They are evading onerous Chinese capital controls instituted by an oppressive regime.
      - avisser 6y ago
        Russian oligarchs probably aren't violating UK laws if they buy property in London either. But I'm fine with laws that make it harder for them. The assumption I make when reading these stories mirrors what I think when I hear the phrase "Russian oligarch" - I'm envisioning connected and well-to-do Chinese who've profited off the authoritarian system they have. I may be wrong in that assumption. But you are assuming that they are victims, rather than co-conspirators in that regime.
        valuearb 6y ago
        Benjamin Franklin: "it is better a hundred guilty persons should escape than one innocent person should suffer." Otto von Bismarck: "it is better that ten innocent men suffer than one guilty man escape." I guess I know with who your views on justice align.
ar7hur 6y ago
In some cases the line is probably thin between "wealthy Chinese trying to park their money outside of China" and "money laundering"
- dahdum 6y ago
  It bothers me how much people are happy to assume criminality in these cases, especially when the capital controls presumed to be broken would be considered outrageous if applied locally.
  - sumedh 6y ago
    >It bothers me how much people are happy to assume criminality in these cases Are you sure taxes are being paid in China before they take out the money? There are documentaries on youtube which show Canadian real estate agents willing to look the other even when they are told that money coming from China is dirty. Ofcourse not all the money is dirty.
    - dahdum 6y ago
      > Are you sure taxes are being paid in China before they take out the money? I don't know either way, but China is more capable than most of handling that. I just can't get behind this xenophobic idea that every foreign buyer is a "money laundering criminal", especially when foreigner is near synonymous with "Chinese".
      - sumedh 6y ago
        > but China is more capable than most of handling that. How do you know that? > I just can't get behind this xenophobic idea that every foreign buyer You are throwing the baby with the bath water. Its not everyone but some of them are.

cool_dude85 6y ago

As mentioned in the article, evading capital controls is money laundering.

valuearb 6y ago
Let’s not conflate fleeing an oppressive regime with actual crimes.
- mtnGoat 6y ago
  Crime is crime, let's not excuse it. You follow the laws of the country you are in regardless of circumstances in your past, coming from oppressive regime isn't a free ticket.
  - valuearb 6y ago
    What Canadian laws are being violated?
    - seemack 6y ago
      Laundering proceeds of crime - https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C-46/section-462.31.html https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C-46/section-462.31...
      - valuearb 6y ago
        From your link: “(a) the commission in Canada of a designated offence; or (b) an act or omission anywhere that, if it had occurred in Canada, would have constituted a designated offence.” I wasn’t aware Canada had a $50,000 limit on moving funds from China.
        seemack 6y ago
        The premise here is evading capital controls. It seems like that would be a crime in Canada.
        valuearb 6y ago
        It isn’t. Free countries don’t enforce the laws of oppressive regimes for them.
- buzzerbetrayed 6y ago
  This is the second time you've said basically this same thing in this thread. I want to know your reasoning. In your mind, how does living in an oppressive regime allow you to blatantly disobey the law in another, non-oppressive regime.
  - valuearb 6y ago
    Because they aren’t violating Canadian laws. They are evading onerous Chinese capital controls instituted by an oppressive regime.
    - avisser 6y ago
      Russian oligarchs probably aren't violating UK laws if they buy property in London either. But I'm fine with laws that make it harder for them. The assumption I make when reading these stories mirrors what I think when I hear the phrase "Russian oligarch" - I'm envisioning connected and well-to-do Chinese who've profited off the authoritarian system they have. I may be wrong in that assumption. But you are assuming that they are victims, rather than co-conspirators in that regime.
      - valuearb 6y ago
        Benjamin Franklin: "it is better a hundred guilty persons should escape than one innocent person should suffer." Otto von Bismarck: "it is better that ten innocent men suffer than one guilty man escape." I guess I know with who your views on justice align.

ar7hur 6y ago

In some cases the line is probably thin between "wealthy Chinese trying to park their money outside of China" and "money laundering"

dahdum 6y ago
It bothers me how much people are happy to assume criminality in these cases, especially when the capital controls presumed to be broken would be considered outrageous if applied locally.
- sumedh 6y ago
  >It bothers me how much people are happy to assume criminality in these cases Are you sure taxes are being paid in China before they take out the money? There are documentaries on youtube which show Canadian real estate agents willing to look the other even when they are told that money coming from China is dirty. Ofcourse not all the money is dirty.
  - dahdum 6y ago
    > Are you sure taxes are being paid in China before they take out the money? I don't know either way, but China is more capable than most of handling that. I just can't get behind this xenophobic idea that every foreign buyer is a "money laundering criminal", especially when foreigner is near synonymous with "Chinese".
    - sumedh 6y ago
      > but China is more capable than most of handling that. How do you know that? > I just can't get behind this xenophobic idea that every foreign buyer You are throwing the baby with the bath water. Its not everyone but some of them are.