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Good showing from AMD. It will be interesting to see how Nvidia responds. I'm curious if AMD will also suffer from supply issues. Does AMD allow running in "

Good showing from AMD. It will be interesting to see how Nvidia responds. I'm curious if AMD will also suffer from supply issues. Does AMD allow running in "rage mode" without voiding the warranty? Is that something that a 3rd party mfg will offer to cover?

zamalek 6y ago
I assume so, given that Ryzen runs in "rage mode" all the time (and RDNA2 is the first architecture where people from the Zen team have been involved). I also assume that you are going to need a high-end case (notwithstanding the PSU) to provide adequate cooling because, if it is anything like Ryzen, it will react strongly to the cooling available to it. It will likely be noisy and, as always with OC, not all cards will have the same headroom: it allows them to avoid promising headroom that may not exist on your individual card.
- kllrnohj 6y ago
  > given that Ryzen runs in "rage mode" all the time It doesn't. "Rage mode" would be equivalent to Ryzen's PBO. Which is definitely not on by default. It's likely equivalent to just dragging the power limit slider to the highest it goes on MSI afterburner. Letting boost go out of power spec limits, but nothing more. Which can still give decent gains (look at how power starved Ampere is, for example). But the only noteworthy thing here is just it's in the official control panel instead of a 3rd party app.
  - zamadatix 6y ago
    Small correction - Rage mode increases the power budget but AMD confirmed it does not max out the power budget the same as sliding the slider all the way to the right. Speculation point: because of this I almost wonder if it's equivalent to selecting a higher TDP rather than a warranty violating OC like PBO was. One of the things people railed on Nvidia for was for ever slightly less perf you could get a much lower wattage card that was quieter, maybe this was the response to that?
    - kllrnohj 6y ago
      PBO basically just selects a higher TDP, too. The warranty violating part of all of these would be you're technically driving the power delivery system beyond what the spec strictly requires. For PBO that'd be your exceeding the spec that AM4 requires from motherboards, which could put you of spec for a motherboard's VRM solution. I don't know if there's a handshake there between the CPU & BIOS to ensure PBO doesn't exceed a given motherboard's specs, though. If there is it'd be hard to claim this would be an actual warranty-violating usage. Rage mode almost certainly respects the vbios limits, so you'll likely see lower-margin cards have basically no improvement from Rage mode, depending on how much they skimped on the power delivery. You'll likely not see an actual push to void warranties as a result, too. Although in both cases (PBO & Rage mode) it's going to be almost impossible for a vendor to actually reject a warranty issue unless you tell them you did this. Afaik nobody is doing something like a blown fuse to keep a permanent record of these feature(s) being used or enabled.
arvinsim 6y ago
That "rage mode" nomenclature might potentially come back to bite them.
- redisman 6y ago
  It’s also a really weird “feature” to highlight. Oh wow you named moving the power slider slightly up - something users have been able to do for years and it takes a few seconds
zanny 6y ago
AMDs been buying 7nm wafers from TSMC for two years now. They should be better equipped to meet demand, or at least more knowledgeable from experience about what kind of supply they can field. Not sure how in the world they plan on supplying both their new cpu and gpu series with a holiday season launch, though.
- 01100011 6y ago
  Exactly. On the one hand they are well established with TSMC, on the other hand, they are trying to meet demand for both CPUs and GPUs simultaneously. Who knows what they'll decide from a business perspective? I wonder how the margins compare between CPUs and GPUs? They could, say, plan on limiting their higher end GPU SKUs which gives them temporary bragging rights in the GPU space but reserves capacity for CPUs.
  - redisman 6y ago
    And Xbox and PS5!
snvzz 6y ago
NVIDIA has simply made an expensive mistake[0] hoping TSMC would offer them lower prices or that Samsung's new process would be ready (it was not), resulting in their worst lineup in a hell of a long time[1]. [0]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXb-8feWoOE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXb-8feWoOE [1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjOnWT9U96g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjOnWT9U96g

zamalek 6y ago

I assume so, given that Ryzen runs in "rage mode" all the time (and RDNA2 is the first architecture where people from the Zen team have been involved). I also assume that you are going to need a high-end case (notwithstanding the PSU) to provide adequate cooling because, if it is anything like Ryzen, it will react strongly to the cooling available to it. It will likely be noisy and, as always with OC, not all cards will have the same headroom: it allows them to avoid promising headroom that may not exist on your individual card.

kllrnohj 6y ago
> given that Ryzen runs in "rage mode" all the time It doesn't. "Rage mode" would be equivalent to Ryzen's PBO. Which is definitely not on by default. It's likely equivalent to just dragging the power limit slider to the highest it goes on MSI afterburner. Letting boost go out of power spec limits, but nothing more. Which can still give decent gains (look at how power starved Ampere is, for example). But the only noteworthy thing here is just it's in the official control panel instead of a 3rd party app.
- zamadatix 6y ago
  Small correction - Rage mode increases the power budget but AMD confirmed it does not max out the power budget the same as sliding the slider all the way to the right. Speculation point: because of this I almost wonder if it's equivalent to selecting a higher TDP rather than a warranty violating OC like PBO was. One of the things people railed on Nvidia for was for ever slightly less perf you could get a much lower wattage card that was quieter, maybe this was the response to that?
  - kllrnohj 6y ago
    PBO basically just selects a higher TDP, too. The warranty violating part of all of these would be you're technically driving the power delivery system beyond what the spec strictly requires. For PBO that'd be your exceeding the spec that AM4 requires from motherboards, which could put you of spec for a motherboard's VRM solution. I don't know if there's a handshake there between the CPU & BIOS to ensure PBO doesn't exceed a given motherboard's specs, though. If there is it'd be hard to claim this would be an actual warranty-violating usage. Rage mode almost certainly respects the vbios limits, so you'll likely see lower-margin cards have basically no improvement from Rage mode, depending on how much they skimped on the power delivery. You'll likely not see an actual push to void warranties as a result, too. Although in both cases (PBO & Rage mode) it's going to be almost impossible for a vendor to actually reject a warranty issue unless you tell them you did this. Afaik nobody is doing something like a blown fuse to keep a permanent record of these feature(s) being used or enabled.

arvinsim 6y ago

That "rage mode" nomenclature might potentially come back to bite them.

redisman 6y ago
It’s also a really weird “feature” to highlight. Oh wow you named moving the power slider slightly up - something users have been able to do for years and it takes a few seconds

zanny 6y ago

AMDs been buying 7nm wafers from TSMC for two years now. They should be better equipped to meet demand, or at least more knowledgeable from experience about what kind of supply they can field. Not sure how in the world they plan on supplying both their new cpu and gpu series with a holiday season launch, though.

01100011 6y ago
Exactly. On the one hand they are well established with TSMC, on the other hand, they are trying to meet demand for both CPUs and GPUs simultaneously. Who knows what they'll decide from a business perspective? I wonder how the margins compare between CPUs and GPUs? They could, say, plan on limiting their higher end GPU SKUs which gives them temporary bragging rights in the GPU space but reserves capacity for CPUs.
- redisman 6y ago
  And Xbox and PS5!

snvzz 6y ago

NVIDIA has simply made an expensive mistake[0] hoping TSMC would offer them lower prices or that Samsung's new process would be ready (it was not), resulting in their worst lineup in a hell of a long time[1]. [0]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXb-8feWoOE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXb-8feWoOE [1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjOnWT9U96g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjOnWT9U96g