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I know people love public transport because of the supposed larger benefit to society but having ridden NYC public transport for over 7 years now I absolutely l

by Grimm1 6y ago

I know people love public transport because of the supposed larger benefit to society but having ridden NYC public transport for over 7 years now I absolutely loath it. The experience is horrible almost every day. Between being crammed in the cars, the mentally unstable accosting you, the lack of cleanliness and the occasional assault I'm simply not willing to deal with that continuously. I put up with it because it was cheaper than owning a car in NYC at a time where I needed to make that trade off but I don't need to make that trade off any more. This is with the MTA receiving billions of dollars and subsidies. Give us a system like Japan or even some of the light rail like I experienced in France and I can see people moving towards public transport. Continue to give us systems like the New York subway and I don't see cars going away. This article makes largely the same point -- the way we do public transport in the US is flawed and technology can help us make it less so, but it has to have buy in from our political systems and the people. As long as institutions like the MTA have a say we'll only see mismanaged and rapidly aging systems.

thrav 6y ago
You could just as easily be writing about BART. The United States fails hard at public transit, even where we’re richest and it makes the most sense. I use it all the time, but I can’t really blame the people who refuse. Tokyo was in a league of its own (2 weeks experience). London Tube was mostly great, with some minor flaws here and there (9 months experience). This is without even beginning to compare the reach and convenience of stations in each system. This feels like looking at our ability to Lockdown for COVID. Even when we attempted to fully close, we sucked at it, and got the worst of both worlds (economic crush + virus still spread). At some point, you have to look in the mirror and stop trying to be something you’re not willing and/or able to be and find a new approach.
bluedino 6y ago
>> Between being crammed in the cars, the mentally unstable accosting you, the lack of cleanliness and the occasional assault Three of the four of those are things you don't hear people complaining about with the transit system in Japan because of the culture differences in the USA. How can that be fixed, here?
- Voloskaya 6y ago
  Calling this a "culture differences" is quite the understatement, unless you include politics, access to healthcare and other things under "culture". I do agree that there is definitly a cultural component to this too however.
  - colinmhayes 6y ago
    I absolutely consider those things culture. The American culture of individualism is the cause of them.
    - Grimm1 6y ago
      I hard disagree with you. Individualism is not the root of our failing infrastructure.
      - Teever 6y ago
        I think that the hyper-individualism that has been cultivated in certain segments of the American population for partisan political purposes is ultimately the greatest threat that American society faces. It corrodes all aspects of society when a sizable population will place themselves above all else. The ironic part is that except for a thin slice of the wealthy it doesn't even benefit the people who espouse it the most.
        Grimm1 6y ago
        Individualism != selfish and ignorant. I'm highly individualist. I stay inside, wear a mask everywhere I go and listed to experts like Dr.Fauci on the subject of Covid. That's just one example. There's a large amount of the population that lack empathy and are willfully ignorant. Individualism may be the cover word but what you actually mean is "hyper ignorance and selfishness"
        colinmhayes 6y ago
screye 6y ago
This happens because the US cannot commit to proper public transport fully. In other places, there are either dedicated bus lanes or entirely separated trams which circumvent traffic all together. They also routinely upgrade their public transport, instead of NYC which incurs massive costs as it keeps 200 yr old infrastructure barely alive. It is also unreasonably cheap. $127 a month is lower than the cost of insurance for many.
- Grimm1 6y ago
  I'm quite aware as someone living the situation but thanks I guess.
- SomeHacker44 6y ago
  $255/month for a 2020 Tesla Model 3 in a garage in Brooklyn for pleasure use. With a 2 car discount. From Geico. A 2010 Acura MDX was just over $200 as a single car, previously. So just one car's insurance is worth two monthly transit passes. I regardless heavily dislike driving in NYC and would rather take Subway or Express Bus to commute.
bart_spoon 6y ago
I'm puzzled as to why its such a mess in the US, even in areas with "good" public transportation, compared to other nations. I lived in Japan for several years, and the subway/rail/bus systems are wonderful. Easy to use, reliable, clean, and no issues the mentally unwell or homeless bothering you. Is it cultural? Or is it a matter of political/economic policy? I have no idea, but I'd kill to be able to bring it to the US.
decafninja 6y ago
Even before Covid, I did everything I could to avoid riding NYC's (and its surrounding regions) public transportation. Namely, bicycle, walk, semi-private ferry services, or even drive. The subways are literally disgusting. I'd happily use the public transportation if it was anything closer to Tokyo, Seoul, Singapore, Hong Kong, or many other cities outside the US.
fomine3 6y ago
In Tokyo, railway companies build commercial building near their stations and its rent is part of their main income. Is it possible in the US?

by Grimm1 6y ago

thrav 6y ago

You could just as easily be writing about BART. The United States fails hard at public transit, even where we’re richest and it makes the most sense. I use it all the time, but I can’t really blame the people who refuse. Tokyo was in a league of its own (2 weeks experience). London Tube was mostly great, with some minor flaws here and there (9 months experience). This is without even beginning to compare the reach and convenience of stations in each system. This feels like looking at our ability to Lockdown for COVID. Even when we attempted to fully close, we sucked at it, and got the worst of both worlds (economic crush + virus still spread). At some point, you have to look in the mirror and stop trying to be something you’re not willing and/or able to be and find a new approach.

bluedino 6y ago

>> Between being crammed in the cars, the mentally unstable accosting you, the lack of cleanliness and the occasional assault Three of the four of those are things you don't hear people complaining about with the transit system in Japan because of the culture differences in the USA. How can that be fixed, here?

Voloskaya 6y ago
Calling this a "culture differences" is quite the understatement, unless you include politics, access to healthcare and other things under "culture". I do agree that there is definitly a cultural component to this too however.
- colinmhayes 6y ago
  I absolutely consider those things culture. The American culture of individualism is the cause of them.
  - Grimm1 6y ago
    I hard disagree with you. Individualism is not the root of our failing infrastructure.
    - Teever 6y ago
      I think that the hyper-individualism that has been cultivated in certain segments of the American population for partisan political purposes is ultimately the greatest threat that American society faces. It corrodes all aspects of society when a sizable population will place themselves above all else. The ironic part is that except for a thin slice of the wealthy it doesn't even benefit the people who espouse it the most.
      - Grimm1 6y ago
        Individualism != selfish and ignorant. I'm highly individualist. I stay inside, wear a mask everywhere I go and listed to experts like Dr.Fauci on the subject of Covid. That's just one example. There's a large amount of the population that lack empathy and are willfully ignorant. Individualism may be the cover word but what you actually mean is "hyper ignorance and selfishness"
        colinmhayes 6y ago

screye 6y ago

This happens because the US cannot commit to proper public transport fully. In other places, there are either dedicated bus lanes or entirely separated trams which circumvent traffic all together. They also routinely upgrade their public transport, instead of NYC which incurs massive costs as it keeps 200 yr old infrastructure barely alive. It is also unreasonably cheap. $127 a month is lower than the cost of insurance for many.

Grimm1 6y ago
I'm quite aware as someone living the situation but thanks I guess.
SomeHacker44 6y ago
$255/month for a 2020 Tesla Model 3 in a garage in Brooklyn for pleasure use. With a 2 car discount. From Geico. A 2010 Acura MDX was just over $200 as a single car, previously. So just one car's insurance is worth two monthly transit passes. I regardless heavily dislike driving in NYC and would rather take Subway or Express Bus to commute.

bart_spoon 6y ago

I'm puzzled as to why its such a mess in the US, even in areas with "good" public transportation, compared to other nations. I lived in Japan for several years, and the subway/rail/bus systems are wonderful. Easy to use, reliable, clean, and no issues the mentally unwell or homeless bothering you. Is it cultural? Or is it a matter of political/economic policy? I have no idea, but I'd kill to be able to bring it to the US.

decafninja 6y ago

Even before Covid, I did everything I could to avoid riding NYC's (and its surrounding regions) public transportation. Namely, bicycle, walk, semi-private ferry services, or even drive. The subways are literally disgusting. I'd happily use the public transportation if it was anything closer to Tokyo, Seoul, Singapore, Hong Kong, or many other cities outside the US.

fomine3 6y ago

In Tokyo, railway companies build commercial building near their stations and its rent is part of their main income. Is it possible in the US?