5 ms·

Autogyros are cool, not quite a helo and quite a plane. They have several unique advantages and are undergoing a modern renaissance after being used in the very

by xnyan 6y ago

Autogyros are cool, not quite a helo and quite a plane. They have several unique advantages and are undergoing a modern renaissance after being used in the very first days of non-fixed wing flight: -Inexpensive and reliable. Far simpler to build and fly vs a helicopter -Can fly at very low speeds without stalling -VERY short landing, pretty much anywhere. Not quite so short take-off, but pre-spooling the horizontal rotary wing can mitigation this. Cost and low stall speed are probably the biggest factors for their choice of autogyro.

rkangel 6y ago
Some others: * Cheap to maintain, run and store (take up much less space than a plane) * Cope much better than a plane with strong cross winds on take off and landing (I've had several lessons when all the fixed wing pilots were stuck in the cafe) * Much smoother ride when going through turbulence - the rotor does a lot of the moving around and leaves the cabin much less affected * Often fly around at a lower altitude than a plane, particularly if you're over fields (often cruise around at 1000 ft above ground). This means that get a better view (things on the ground aren't too small), and the cloud ceiling can be lower. * Manoeuverable and 'fun' to fly Some disadvantages (limiting myself to the main commercially available pre-built ones, i.e. AutoGyro and Magni): * Slower than a plane (max speed of any is I believe 125 MPH) * Can only take two people, and often limited luggage space * Haven't been around as long (in their modern form), so while they're cheaper to buy than a plane, you are limited to new or fairly new. * None are instrument rated, and only one model is night rated (in the UK) * You don't really want to fly them in the rain - erodes rotor and propellor
- BasilPH 6y ago
  > You don't really want to fly them in the rain - erodes rotor and propellor I'm intrigued, could you elaborate on why this is different from what happens with a helicopter or a plane in the rain?
  - rootusrootus 6y ago
    I believe it's exactly the same problem as with a helicopter. Blade speeds near the tip can be pretty high, so rain can damage some materials. It's apparently not much of an issue with alloy blades, more of a thing with composites. I suspect it's more of a price issue -- gyrocopters are trying to hit a different price point than most helicopters. Also, plenty of gyrocopter pilots fly in the rain.
    - rkangel 6y ago
      > Also, plenty of gyrocopter pilots fly in the rain. Indeed. I think it's just a question of shortening the life of the rotor a bit. Another problem is visibility. We had to land in a hurry at the end of my lesson on Monday due to rain arriving at the airfield. I fly a Magni M16 which is an open cockpit and it was quite hard to see with the rain on the windscreen and my visor. There are no wipers or anything to help with that (like you might have on a fixed wing). I don't have the comparable experience in the closed cockpit aircraft though (e.g. Magni M24), so that may be better anyway.
    - kevin_thibedeau 6y ago
      Isn't that what polyurethane helicopter tape is for?
  - rkangel 6y ago
    I don't actually know. Some of it is to do with the material they're made of. Some gyros have an aluminium rotor and some composite - the aluminium ones are happier in the rain. It's possible something similar applies to the prop.
  - erikig 6y ago
    I'd imagine that at the speeds that the tips are spinning each droplet of water is almost like a little bullet hitting the rotor due to surface tension /ArmchairPhysics
- Kaytaro 6y ago
  I assume they are much quieter than a helicopter?
  - rkangel 6y ago
    Yes they are. Helicopters inevitably push their noise downwards, and need more power for the same size of aircraft (I believe).
- F00Fbug 6y ago
  How's the vibration? I've been a fixed-wing pilot for many years. I recently sold my share in a 182 and have considered a gyro for many of the reasons listed here. All the YouTube videos I've seen look like the thing is going to vibrate itself apart! Although, that could be due to strapping a GoPro to a strut or something!
  - rkangel 6y ago
    Very little? A little through the stick, but it's not something I've ever thought about, which should probably answer the question. I agree that the GoPros attached to the mast vibrate a lot, but I got the same when I attached one to a car on a track. These bodycam shots from James Ketchell don't vibrate very much for instance: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vn5gVZ4PnmY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vn5gVZ4PnmY
  - rkangel 6y ago
    There is one other practical issue with Gyros in the UK (and is my biggest problem) - there are instructors but not really flying clubs. After passing if you want to keep flying you can't just rent one by the hour, you need to buy one (or buy a share).
    - xnyan 6y ago
      I think that's because the cost of owning a gyro can be so much lower than a traditional fixed wing. As little as $20K can get you into old but high quality used or $100k for entry-level new. A fraction of planes. Not exactly cheap, but neither is spending significant time in a flight club.
- JoeAltmaier 6y ago
  Do they still have the oscillation problem? Where they start to pitch and the pilot over-compensates which results in an uncontrollable pendulum swing until it stalls? I recall that killed quite a few early pilots.
  - rkangel 6y ago
    Pilot induced oscillation is possible, and it's something you're trained on avoiding. Modern Gyros are much more stable (have better negative feedback to return them to straight and level) so you need much more extreme control movements to cause it.

by xnyan 6y ago

rkangel 6y ago

Some others: * Cheap to maintain, run and store (take up much less space than a plane) * Cope much better than a plane with strong cross winds on take off and landing (I've had several lessons when all the fixed wing pilots were stuck in the cafe) * Much smoother ride when going through turbulence - the rotor does a lot of the moving around and leaves the cabin much less affected * Often fly around at a lower altitude than a plane, particularly if you're over fields (often cruise around at 1000 ft above ground). This means that get a better view (things on the ground aren't too small), and the cloud ceiling can be lower. * Manoeuverable and 'fun' to fly Some disadvantages (limiting myself to the main commercially available pre-built ones, i.e. AutoGyro and Magni): * Slower than a plane (max speed of any is I believe 125 MPH) * Can only take two people, and often limited luggage space * Haven't been around as long (in their modern form), so while they're cheaper to buy than a plane, you are limited to new or fairly new. * None are instrument rated, and only one model is night rated (in the UK) * You don't really want to fly them in the rain - erodes rotor and propellor

BasilPH 6y ago
> You don't really want to fly them in the rain - erodes rotor and propellor I'm intrigued, could you elaborate on why this is different from what happens with a helicopter or a plane in the rain?
- rootusrootus 6y ago
  I believe it's exactly the same problem as with a helicopter. Blade speeds near the tip can be pretty high, so rain can damage some materials. It's apparently not much of an issue with alloy blades, more of a thing with composites. I suspect it's more of a price issue -- gyrocopters are trying to hit a different price point than most helicopters. Also, plenty of gyrocopter pilots fly in the rain.
  - rkangel 6y ago
    > Also, plenty of gyrocopter pilots fly in the rain. Indeed. I think it's just a question of shortening the life of the rotor a bit. Another problem is visibility. We had to land in a hurry at the end of my lesson on Monday due to rain arriving at the airfield. I fly a Magni M16 which is an open cockpit and it was quite hard to see with the rain on the windscreen and my visor. There are no wipers or anything to help with that (like you might have on a fixed wing). I don't have the comparable experience in the closed cockpit aircraft though (e.g. Magni M24), so that may be better anyway.
  - kevin_thibedeau 6y ago
    Isn't that what polyurethane helicopter tape is for?
- rkangel 6y ago
  I don't actually know. Some of it is to do with the material they're made of. Some gyros have an aluminium rotor and some composite - the aluminium ones are happier in the rain. It's possible something similar applies to the prop.
- erikig 6y ago
  I'd imagine that at the speeds that the tips are spinning each droplet of water is almost like a little bullet hitting the rotor due to surface tension /ArmchairPhysics
Kaytaro 6y ago
I assume they are much quieter than a helicopter?
- rkangel 6y ago
  Yes they are. Helicopters inevitably push their noise downwards, and need more power for the same size of aircraft (I believe).
F00Fbug 6y ago
How's the vibration? I've been a fixed-wing pilot for many years. I recently sold my share in a 182 and have considered a gyro for many of the reasons listed here. All the YouTube videos I've seen look like the thing is going to vibrate itself apart! Although, that could be due to strapping a GoPro to a strut or something!
- rkangel 6y ago
  Very little? A little through the stick, but it's not something I've ever thought about, which should probably answer the question. I agree that the GoPros attached to the mast vibrate a lot, but I got the same when I attached one to a car on a track. These bodycam shots from James Ketchell don't vibrate very much for instance: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vn5gVZ4PnmY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vn5gVZ4PnmY
- rkangel 6y ago
  There is one other practical issue with Gyros in the UK (and is my biggest problem) - there are instructors but not really flying clubs. After passing if you want to keep flying you can't just rent one by the hour, you need to buy one (or buy a share).
  - xnyan 6y ago
    I think that's because the cost of owning a gyro can be so much lower than a traditional fixed wing. As little as $20K can get you into old but high quality used or $100k for entry-level new. A fraction of planes. Not exactly cheap, but neither is spending significant time in a flight club.
JoeAltmaier 6y ago
Do they still have the oscillation problem? Where they start to pitch and the pilot over-compensates which results in an uncontrollable pendulum swing until it stalls? I recall that killed quite a few early pilots.
- rkangel 6y ago
  Pilot induced oscillation is possible, and it's something you're trained on avoiding. Modern Gyros are much more stable (have better negative feedback to return them to straight and level) so you need much more extreme control movements to cause it.