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Exactly this. Vitamin D level is a proxy for general health. Studies that have controlled for other factors affecting health have not found a protective effect

by twic 6y ago

Exactly this. Vitamin D level is a proxy for general health. Studies that have controlled for other factors affecting health have not found a protective effect from vitamin D [1]. Hacker News is obsessed with vitamin D because it seems like a hack. A cheap and simple way to solve a tough problem that you can feel smart about having found. [1] https://www.nice.org.uk/advice/es28/evidence/evidence-review-pdf-8777674477 https://www.nice.org.uk/advice/es28/evidence/evidence-review...

graeme 6y ago
It’s rather poor form to link a 60 page report without specifying which section supports your argument. I skimmed it and didn’t see what you said, and the summary recommends vitamin d supplementation in general. Further, this spanish RCT suggests vitamin D had incredibly strong effects in preventing patients from needing to go to the ICU. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0960076020302764?via%3Dihub https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S096007602...
stefan_ 6y ago
With the added bonus that while Vitamin D is a proxy for general health, supplementing it does nothing. It's the perfect science ignorance bonfire.
- itake 6y ago
  I see this idea posted a lot. Do you have any sources to back this up?
  - howlgarnish 6y ago
    There have been a lot of studies done on vitamin D supplements, and there is essentially no significant evidence that supplementation is useful for anything. The sole exception is rickets, which is caused by vitamin D deficiency. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitamin_D#Use_of_supplements https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitamin_D#Use_of_supplements There is also considerable debate over the comparative efficiency & effects of natural synthesis via sunlight vs ingesting supplements, compounded by the difficulty of accounting for things like exercising outdoors vs being sedentary indoors.
    - fyfy18 6y ago
      Annecdotal: I live in a fairly northern country, and I've heard quite a lot of people say their mood is more normal over winter if they supplement with Vitamin D.
      - timmytokyo 6y ago
        I don't have any strong opinion one way or another on the efficacy of vitamin D. But people who say they feel better after taking it may themselves be experiencing a placebo effect. Placebo effects are real, and they can improve both mood and health. The mind is an amazing thing.
- icedchai 6y ago
  Except it does seem to help: https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2017/02/study-confirms-vitamin-d-protects-against-cold-and-flu/ https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2017/02/study-confirm...
nostromo 6y ago
One pilot study found that a big Vitamin D dose would cut the hospital length in half for people on ventilators. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4939707/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4939707/ The control group spent on average 36 days in the hospital, the group getting a single 500,000 IU dose of vitamin D3 spent an average of 18 days in the hospital. This study isn't correlation, it was a double blind randomized control trial. However, it was a small pilot study and more research is needed.
- DangerousPie 6y ago
  The fact that this was based on only 31 people, showed a marginal effect (barely passed even the lenient p < 0.05 threshold) and doesn't seem to have been replicated in a bigger study despite being published 4 years ago should make you very sceptical about it. Sure, more research would be good, but nobody should be making any decisions based on this.
scythe 6y ago
That isn't what that paper says. From "limitations of the evidence": >All 5 studies were assessed as being at high risk of bias What is not here is any study controlling for the factors you mention and finding a zero correlation as you claim. The conclusion, which I assume you are referring to, states: >There is no evidence to support taking vitamin D supplements to specifically prevent or treat COVID-19. However, all people should continue to follow UK Government advice on daily vitamin D supplementation to maintain bone and muscle health during the COVID-19 pandemic. Since vitamin D supplements are already advised for the general population, it is extremely unlikely they would be recommended for specifically COVID-19 without very high-quality evidence. Unless dosing recommendations can be given with good reason to believe those recommendations would be beneficial, the only effect that could come of a positive conclusion is risk compensation, i.e. increased risky behaviors, which is bad.
icedchai 6y ago
Maybe not for Covid specifically, but they have found it helps with other respiratory diseases. Example: https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2017/02/study-confirms-vitamin-d-protects-against-cold-and-flu/ https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2017/02/study-confirm... I take 2000 IU every day and have for years. My doctor said my vitamin D levels were low, but they are now in normal range.
0x008 6y ago
I am only one data point, but from my experience, it really is a hack. I had super crazy migranes, was always tired and felt unmotived. Then I started supplementing Vitamin D and now I feel so energetic, it is kind of scary.

by twic 6y ago

graeme 6y ago

It’s rather poor form to link a 60 page report without specifying which section supports your argument. I skimmed it and didn’t see what you said, and the summary recommends vitamin d supplementation in general. Further, this spanish RCT suggests vitamin D had incredibly strong effects in preventing patients from needing to go to the ICU. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0960076020302764?via%3Dihub https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S096007602...

stefan_ 6y ago

With the added bonus that while Vitamin D is a proxy for general health, supplementing it does nothing. It's the perfect science ignorance bonfire.

itake 6y ago
I see this idea posted a lot. Do you have any sources to back this up?
- howlgarnish 6y ago
  There have been a lot of studies done on vitamin D supplements, and there is essentially no significant evidence that supplementation is useful for anything. The sole exception is rickets, which is caused by vitamin D deficiency. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitamin_D#Use_of_supplements https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitamin_D#Use_of_supplements There is also considerable debate over the comparative efficiency & effects of natural synthesis via sunlight vs ingesting supplements, compounded by the difficulty of accounting for things like exercising outdoors vs being sedentary indoors.
  - fyfy18 6y ago
    Annecdotal: I live in a fairly northern country, and I've heard quite a lot of people say their mood is more normal over winter if they supplement with Vitamin D.
    - timmytokyo 6y ago
      I don't have any strong opinion one way or another on the efficacy of vitamin D. But people who say they feel better after taking it may themselves be experiencing a placebo effect. Placebo effects are real, and they can improve both mood and health. The mind is an amazing thing.
icedchai 6y ago
Except it does seem to help: https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2017/02/study-confirms-vitamin-d-protects-against-cold-and-flu/ https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2017/02/study-confirm...

nostromo 6y ago

One pilot study found that a big Vitamin D dose would cut the hospital length in half for people on ventilators. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4939707/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4939707/ The control group spent on average 36 days in the hospital, the group getting a single 500,000 IU dose of vitamin D3 spent an average of 18 days in the hospital. This study isn't correlation, it was a double blind randomized control trial. However, it was a small pilot study and more research is needed.

DangerousPie 6y ago
The fact that this was based on only 31 people, showed a marginal effect (barely passed even the lenient p < 0.05 threshold) and doesn't seem to have been replicated in a bigger study despite being published 4 years ago should make you very sceptical about it. Sure, more research would be good, but nobody should be making any decisions based on this.

scythe 6y ago

That isn't what that paper says. From "limitations of the evidence": >All 5 studies were assessed as being at high risk of bias What is not here is any study controlling for the factors you mention and finding a zero correlation as you claim. The conclusion, which I assume you are referring to, states: >There is no evidence to support taking vitamin D supplements to specifically prevent or treat COVID-19. However, all people should continue to follow UK Government advice on daily vitamin D supplementation to maintain bone and muscle health during the COVID-19 pandemic. Since vitamin D supplements are already advised for the general population, it is extremely unlikely they would be recommended for specifically COVID-19 without very high-quality evidence. Unless dosing recommendations can be given with good reason to believe those recommendations would be beneficial, the only effect that could come of a positive conclusion is risk compensation, i.e. increased risky behaviors, which is bad.

icedchai 6y ago

Maybe not for Covid specifically, but they have found it helps with other respiratory diseases. Example: https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2017/02/study-confirms-vitamin-d-protects-against-cold-and-flu/ https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2017/02/study-confirm... I take 2000 IU every day and have for years. My doctor said my vitamin D levels were low, but they are now in normal range.

0x008 6y ago

I am only one data point, but from my experience, it really is a hack. I had super crazy migranes, was always tired and felt unmotived. Then I started supplementing Vitamin D and now I feel so energetic, it is kind of scary.