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No code can be great if you want to spin up something simple quickly. Once it grows to any reasonable level of complexity it becomes more of a hindrance than a

No code can be great if you want to spin up something simple quickly. Once it grows to any reasonable level of complexity it becomes more of a hindrance than a help. Access was actually a great tool for allowing semi-technical people make quick apps, but almost every shop I've been in has needed to convert Access to grown-up software.

tabtab 6y ago
Granted, it's a good way to prototype ideas. Less analysis is needed when one converts from Access to the new thing because the ideas are road tested. But one problem is that modern web stacks are a bloated incoherent mess that take an army of specialists to manage. That may be part of the reason for the resurgence of "no code" tools. But the real fix is to simplify web stacks for smaller projects. We don't need Rube Goldberg routing engines/URL-prettifiers, ORM organics, Bootcrap organics (UI), Async/Await bloat, etc. We want our app track some local e-paper-work, not be Netflix. A Learjet will do, don't gear it for Jumbo Jets. Time for a KISS web stack to become a de-facto standard.
- asdfman123 6y ago
  Oh yeah, Access was great for prototyping and I've argued as much here several times. I've built Access prototypes in earlier jobs. > But the real fix is to simplify web stacks for smaller projects We've already done that. RoR, Django, ASP.NET MVC, etc. etc. It's super easy to get something working out of the box. But at some point, you still need to understand what your database is doing and optimize for it. Some level of complexity is inescapable. And you could probably argue that as back-end has gotten simpler, complexity has just expanded to fill the void. Now we expect fancy JS interfaces on top of them, too. And phone apps. I have no doubt all of the things I mentioned will get simpler, but I can't foresee anything that will make software devs irrelevant in on the immediate horizon. I suppose at some point BAs/PMs (people who gather requirements and draw wireframes) will be able to write code, and we'll start to compete more with skilled BAs. But that's still not the end of the entire profession. Gathering requirements is still hard.
monksy 6y ago
Same can be said for Python, VB, and VBA.
tootie 6y ago
A lot never will though. I don't see no-code replacing many custom developed applications. It see it making apps accessible for processes that used to managed by spreadsheet and email.

tabtab 6y ago

Granted, it's a good way to prototype ideas. Less analysis is needed when one converts from Access to the new thing because the ideas are road tested. But one problem is that modern web stacks are a bloated incoherent mess that take an army of specialists to manage. That may be part of the reason for the resurgence of "no code" tools. But the real fix is to simplify web stacks for smaller projects. We don't need Rube Goldberg routing engines/URL-prettifiers, ORM organics, Bootcrap organics (UI), Async/Await bloat, etc. We want our app track some local e-paper-work, not be Netflix. A Learjet will do, don't gear it for Jumbo Jets. Time for a KISS web stack to become a de-facto standard.

asdfman123 6y ago
Oh yeah, Access was great for prototyping and I've argued as much here several times. I've built Access prototypes in earlier jobs. > But the real fix is to simplify web stacks for smaller projects We've already done that. RoR, Django, ASP.NET MVC, etc. etc. It's super easy to get something working out of the box. But at some point, you still need to understand what your database is doing and optimize for it. Some level of complexity is inescapable. And you could probably argue that as back-end has gotten simpler, complexity has just expanded to fill the void. Now we expect fancy JS interfaces on top of them, too. And phone apps. I have no doubt all of the things I mentioned will get simpler, but I can't foresee anything that will make software devs irrelevant in on the immediate horizon. I suppose at some point BAs/PMs (people who gather requirements and draw wireframes) will be able to write code, and we'll start to compete more with skilled BAs. But that's still not the end of the entire profession. Gathering requirements is still hard.

monksy 6y ago

Same can be said for Python, VB, and VBA.

tootie 6y ago

A lot never will though. I don't see no-code replacing many custom developed applications. It see it making apps accessible for processes that used to managed by spreadsheet and email.