4 ms·

Or, using temporal interference patterns of intersecting electrical waves to produce deep stimulation in humans - - without genetic modificatiom https://www.bi

Or, using temporal interference patterns of intersecting electrical waves to produce deep stimulation in humans - - without genetic modificatiom https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2019.12.25.888412v2.full https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2019.12.25.888412v2....

whymauri 6y ago
I haven't read this bioRxiv paper, but what's the difference between it and this Cell paper from 2017? https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28575667/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28575667/
- mattkrause 6y ago
  "Deep" in the mouse is a few millimeters, while deep brain structures in primates are 10-15x deeper. In primates, the fields would be harder to precisely interfere because of our thicker skulls and larger, more convoluted brains. The level of c-fos activation in the Cell paper is also a little crazy--it seems way too intense to be correct, especially when compared against direct electrophysiological measurements. It's also not 100% clear that the high frequency fields do nothing--there are some claims that they have DC-like effects due to hysteresis in the neurons' membrane potentials.
  - whymauri 6y ago
    Oh snap, I didn't notice the animal model changed. Thanks for the heads up and rundown!
mattkrause 6y ago
You don't even necessarily need the temporal interference--we got it to work reasonably well in awake, behaving monkeys (where we could measure single-neuron activity directly). https://www.pnas.org/content/116/12/5747.abstract https://www.pnas.org/content/116/12/5747.abstract
- dr_dshiv 6y ago
  Sir, that is some fantastic science. Hats off. 1. To what extent does your work imply the ability of local field potentials to entrain neural activity? Are the electrical fields strong enough? 2. The fact that humans and the occasional cockatoo/seal are the only animals capable of entraining to a beat is quite remarkable, given that brains are basically collections of powered oscillators (which naturally synchronize and entrain). This makes me think that there must be some elaborate set of defenses against entrainment - - defenses that only humans (and the occasional cockatoo/seal) are able to lower.

whymauri 6y ago

I haven't read this bioRxiv paper, but what's the difference between it and this Cell paper from 2017? https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28575667/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28575667/

mattkrause 6y ago
"Deep" in the mouse is a few millimeters, while deep brain structures in primates are 10-15x deeper. In primates, the fields would be harder to precisely interfere because of our thicker skulls and larger, more convoluted brains. The level of c-fos activation in the Cell paper is also a little crazy--it seems way too intense to be correct, especially when compared against direct electrophysiological measurements. It's also not 100% clear that the high frequency fields do nothing--there are some claims that they have DC-like effects due to hysteresis in the neurons' membrane potentials.
- whymauri 6y ago
  Oh snap, I didn't notice the animal model changed. Thanks for the heads up and rundown!

mattkrause 6y ago

You don't even necessarily need the temporal interference--we got it to work reasonably well in awake, behaving monkeys (where we could measure single-neuron activity directly). https://www.pnas.org/content/116/12/5747.abstract https://www.pnas.org/content/116/12/5747.abstract

dr_dshiv 6y ago
Sir, that is some fantastic science. Hats off. 1. To what extent does your work imply the ability of local field potentials to entrain neural activity? Are the electrical fields strong enough? 2. The fact that humans and the occasional cockatoo/seal are the only animals capable of entraining to a beat is quite remarkable, given that brains are basically collections of powered oscillators (which naturally synchronize and entrain). This makes me think that there must be some elaborate set of defenses against entrainment - - defenses that only humans (and the occasional cockatoo/seal) are able to lower.