4 ms·

This IS good news. Now (soon, hopefully) people can acquire immunity through a vaccine, instead of through a virus that leaves long-lasting damage to the body

This IS good news. Now (soon, hopefully) people can acquire immunity through a vaccine, instead of through a virus that leaves long-lasting damage to the body (in particular, but not limited to, the brain).

singemonkey 6y ago
As well as acquiring immunity without being infectious. However, the efficacy of this vaccine (and all the other candidates) still needs to be clarified - ie is it like a measles vaccination (~90% efficacy) or the flu vaccines (~ 25% - 50% I believe).
- viraptor 6y ago
  Sounds right for the flu. I was curious about the details - here's a good starting point. https://www.cdc.gov/flu/vaccines-work/vaccineeffect.htm?CDC_AA_refVal=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cdc.gov%2Fflu%2Fprevent%2Fvaccineeffect.htm#doe_flu_vax_effect_vary_by_type_subtype https://www.cdc.gov/flu/vaccines-work/vaccineeffect.htm?CDC_...
- lbeltrame 6y ago
  For the FDA to even consider an emergency use authorization, they have put the following requirements: - Efficacy of at least 60% - Lower bound of efficacy (confidence interval) >= 30% - Minimum safety data for at least one or two months post vaccination (I don't remember if it's one or two) - At least five severe cases in the control arm - Requirements for the trials to go on even if efficacy is found for an additional year after the trial end (for most of the trials, this means two years in total)
umanwizard 6y ago
Do you have a source on how common severe long-term effects from Covid are? All I’ve seen are anecdotes.
- mcintyre1994 6y ago
  There are some stats here for the UK, based on a symptom tracking app that's been active since about March. https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-long-covid-warning-as-study-finds-one-in-20-have-virus-symptoms-for-eight-weeks-or-more-12109990 https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-long-covid-warning-as... > One in 20 people with coronavirus are likely to have symptoms for eight weeks or more, according to a new study by King's College London. > The research, which uses data from the COVID Symptom Study App, suggested so-called "long COVID" affects around 10% of 18 to 49-year-olds who become unwell with coronavirus. Whole study is here: https://www.kcl.ac.uk/news/study-identifies-those-most-risk-long-covid https://www.kcl.ac.uk/news/study-identifies-those-most-risk-...
  - umanwizard 6y ago
    From your first link: 10% had any symptoms lasting longer than four weeks. That’s not “severe long-term effects”. The actual study seems to say 1 in 20 have symptoms for eight weeks, which might be closer to what you could fairly describe as “long-term”, but says nothing about the severity (though I haven’t waded through the whole article). Anyway, the drop-off from 10% having symptoms at 4 weeks to 5% at 8 weeks is encouraging - it intuitively suggests that the negative symptoms aren’t permanent, even if they take a long time to go away.
    - breakfastduck 6y ago
      8 weeks certainly shouldn't be classified as 'long term'. Long term health effect claims are being made all over the show - if this is the measure that is outrageous reporting. Most people would worry about 'long term health effects' as they'd usually assume that it's going to go on for years.
      - LandR 6y ago
        Yeah, last time I was sick I had the flu. I had lingering effects for around 8-10 weeks after. Eventually I had to go to hospital to get checked. I feel a lot of Covid effects are being massively overblown because people aren't aware that other more common viruses that we don't worry about can have these "long term" effects as well.
soulofmischief 6y ago
> in particular, but not limited to, the brain Judging from our response to Covid-19, if this had actually been the collectively-feared zombie virus, the pandemic would have been far worse than any fictional account has manage to capture so far.
- emiliobumachar 6y ago
  It can't get much worse than everybody dead except for a dozen people in a basement, can it?
- uxcolumbo 6y ago
  How so? World War Z Walking Dead Shawn of the Dead * 28 Days Later The Last of Us What's worse than the above? * (ok maybe not this one)
  - soulofmischief 6y ago
    As science fiction is speculative, I do not fault any of those listed media however I feel none of them truly captured the sociopolitical insanity that would occur, the sheer level of ignorance and incompetence which causes anything that could go wrong, to go wrong.
  - TimPC 6y ago
    Also if there was a real zombie virus none of the movies so far have captured the sheer absolute terror of hard to defend transmission vectors like mosquitos, which would be likely to get the virus. Brings a whole new level of issues to not getting bit.
  - joe_momma 6y ago
    We are headed towards: Hunger Games, Children of Men, Demolition Man, Judge Dredd, Escape from NY/LA
- mcv 6y ago
  Future zombie apocalypse stories need to include people who deny it as a hoax, blame it on foreign countries, claim it's just a mild flu, just continue partying as if there's no risk at all, claim it's caused by 5G technology, claim it's a conspiracy by the elite to accomplish whatever, and political parties split on the topic.
cheph 6y ago
> leaves long-lasting damage to the body (in particular, but not limited to, the brain). In what percentage of people who get COVID-19 is there long-lasting damage to the body? What other conditions did the people who get long-lasting damage to the body have? How does these numbers compare with other diseases? Would appreciate citations.
- henearkr 6y ago
  Most people with COVID even with few symptoms have a loss of smell. If you like numbers, I read that around 80% of people with COVID report loss of smell. And this is one kind of neurological effect. This is a more global view of how the virus could affect the brain: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-we-know-so-far-about-how-covid-affects-the-nervous-system/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-we-know-so-f... And I'm not even touching the subjects of damage to the heart, clotting problems, etc.
  - jlokier 6y ago
    The loss of smell is thought to be sensory, not due to affecting the brain. However, those covid-induced strokes definitely affect the brain.
    - henearkr 6y ago
      Yes you're right indeed, the Scientific American article even mentions what you say.
- OJFord 6y ago
  Nobody had it long enough ago to answer that. SARS-CoV-1 (1) patients have suffered years afterwards, see e.g. this article from 2010: https://www.thestar.com/life/health_wellness/2010/09/02/sars_survivors_struggle_with_symptoms_years_later.html https://www.thestar.com/life/health_wellness/2010/09/02/sars...
  - anoncake 6y ago

singemonkey 6y ago

As well as acquiring immunity without being infectious. However, the efficacy of this vaccine (and all the other candidates) still needs to be clarified - ie is it like a measles vaccination (~90% efficacy) or the flu vaccines (~ 25% - 50% I believe).

viraptor 6y ago
Sounds right for the flu. I was curious about the details - here's a good starting point. https://www.cdc.gov/flu/vaccines-work/vaccineeffect.htm?CDC_AA_refVal=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cdc.gov%2Fflu%2Fprevent%2Fvaccineeffect.htm#doe_flu_vax_effect_vary_by_type_subtype https://www.cdc.gov/flu/vaccines-work/vaccineeffect.htm?CDC_...
lbeltrame 6y ago
For the FDA to even consider an emergency use authorization, they have put the following requirements: - Efficacy of at least 60% - Lower bound of efficacy (confidence interval) >= 30% - Minimum safety data for at least one or two months post vaccination (I don't remember if it's one or two) - At least five severe cases in the control arm - Requirements for the trials to go on even if efficacy is found for an additional year after the trial end (for most of the trials, this means two years in total)

umanwizard 6y ago

Do you have a source on how common severe long-term effects from Covid are? All I’ve seen are anecdotes.

mcintyre1994 6y ago
There are some stats here for the UK, based on a symptom tracking app that's been active since about March. https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-long-covid-warning-as-study-finds-one-in-20-have-virus-symptoms-for-eight-weeks-or-more-12109990 https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-long-covid-warning-as... > One in 20 people with coronavirus are likely to have symptoms for eight weeks or more, according to a new study by King's College London. > The research, which uses data from the COVID Symptom Study App, suggested so-called "long COVID" affects around 10% of 18 to 49-year-olds who become unwell with coronavirus. Whole study is here: https://www.kcl.ac.uk/news/study-identifies-those-most-risk-long-covid https://www.kcl.ac.uk/news/study-identifies-those-most-risk-...
- umanwizard 6y ago
  From your first link: 10% had any symptoms lasting longer than four weeks. That’s not “severe long-term effects”. The actual study seems to say 1 in 20 have symptoms for eight weeks, which might be closer to what you could fairly describe as “long-term”, but says nothing about the severity (though I haven’t waded through the whole article). Anyway, the drop-off from 10% having symptoms at 4 weeks to 5% at 8 weeks is encouraging - it intuitively suggests that the negative symptoms aren’t permanent, even if they take a long time to go away.
  - breakfastduck 6y ago
    8 weeks certainly shouldn't be classified as 'long term'. Long term health effect claims are being made all over the show - if this is the measure that is outrageous reporting. Most people would worry about 'long term health effects' as they'd usually assume that it's going to go on for years.
    - LandR 6y ago
      Yeah, last time I was sick I had the flu. I had lingering effects for around 8-10 weeks after. Eventually I had to go to hospital to get checked. I feel a lot of Covid effects are being massively overblown because people aren't aware that other more common viruses that we don't worry about can have these "long term" effects as well.

soulofmischief 6y ago

> in particular, but not limited to, the brain Judging from our response to Covid-19, if this had actually been the collectively-feared zombie virus, the pandemic would have been far worse than any fictional account has manage to capture so far.

emiliobumachar 6y ago
It can't get much worse than everybody dead except for a dozen people in a basement, can it?
uxcolumbo 6y ago
How so? World War Z Walking Dead Shawn of the Dead * 28 Days Later The Last of Us What's worse than the above? * (ok maybe not this one)
- soulofmischief 6y ago
  As science fiction is speculative, I do not fault any of those listed media however I feel none of them truly captured the sociopolitical insanity that would occur, the sheer level of ignorance and incompetence which causes anything that could go wrong, to go wrong.
- TimPC 6y ago
  Also if there was a real zombie virus none of the movies so far have captured the sheer absolute terror of hard to defend transmission vectors like mosquitos, which would be likely to get the virus. Brings a whole new level of issues to not getting bit.
- joe_momma 6y ago
  We are headed towards: Hunger Games, Children of Men, Demolition Man, Judge Dredd, Escape from NY/LA
mcv 6y ago
Future zombie apocalypse stories need to include people who deny it as a hoax, blame it on foreign countries, claim it's just a mild flu, just continue partying as if there's no risk at all, claim it's caused by 5G technology, claim it's a conspiracy by the elite to accomplish whatever, and political parties split on the topic.

cheph 6y ago

> leaves long-lasting damage to the body (in particular, but not limited to, the brain). In what percentage of people who get COVID-19 is there long-lasting damage to the body? What other conditions did the people who get long-lasting damage to the body have? How does these numbers compare with other diseases? Would appreciate citations.

henearkr 6y ago
Most people with COVID even with few symptoms have a loss of smell. If you like numbers, I read that around 80% of people with COVID report loss of smell. And this is one kind of neurological effect. This is a more global view of how the virus could affect the brain: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-we-know-so-far-about-how-covid-affects-the-nervous-system/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-we-know-so-f... And I'm not even touching the subjects of damage to the heart, clotting problems, etc.
- jlokier 6y ago
  The loss of smell is thought to be sensory, not due to affecting the brain. However, those covid-induced strokes definitely affect the brain.
  - henearkr 6y ago
    Yes you're right indeed, the Scientific American article even mentions what you say.
OJFord 6y ago
Nobody had it long enough ago to answer that. SARS-CoV-1 (1) patients have suffered years afterwards, see e.g. this article from 2010: https://www.thestar.com/life/health_wellness/2010/09/02/sars_survivors_struggle_with_symptoms_years_later.html https://www.thestar.com/life/health_wellness/2010/09/02/sars...
- anoncake 6y ago