4 ms·

> “We found actual photos of the workers at 2 in the morning dumping — not only dumping barrels off of the barges in the middle of the Santa Monica Basin,” he s

> “We found actual photos of the workers at 2 in the morning dumping — not only dumping barrels off of the barges in the middle of the Santa Monica Basin,” he said, “but before they would dump the barrels, they would take a big ax or hatchet to them, and cut them open on purpose so they would sink.” Incredible.

1propionyl 6y ago
See? This is why we don't need environmental regulations. The market will regulate itself if externalities are properly priced in! (Just pay no mind to how those externalities might be systematically priced and how penalties might be retroactively enforced. If you do you're a freedom-hating socialist!)
- faitswulff 6y ago
  > A pilot experiment more than a decade ago to bury the DDT [at the Palos Verdes superfund site] under a thick cap of clean sand showed mixed results. Then sampling in 2009 suggested that most of the DDT had mysteriously vanished — prompting a burst of headlines and more internal paralysis. The longtime project manager unexpectedly retired, and many of the scientists who had dedicated decades of their careers to the chemical have also either retired or moved on. The fact that DDT outlasted the scientists' careers is another strike (among many) against untrammeled libertarian free market thinking.
  - 1propionyl 6y ago
    Ah, so the front fell off. In that case the DDT was just transported outside of the environment. There's nothing there, except water, and fish, and birds. (In case it isn't clear to anyone, this is heavy sarcasm and a reference to a well known satirical skit.)
    - mercer 6y ago
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3m5qxZm_JqM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3m5qxZm_JqM
- refurb 6y ago
  That's a silly comment considering it was the gov't who has done a shit-ton of ocean dumping in the past (not this case, but others). Who will regulate the government?
  - amcoastal 6y ago
    The people. People like me, and I would hope you, would demand the government pass laws to not do these things.
    - yeezul 6y ago
      And how exactly are you asking your government to pass those laws?
      - hanniabu 6y ago
        Through voting and protests. If those don't work then there's also other avenues.
- nickpp 6y ago
  After the 2nd world war, governments all over the world exploded atomic ordinance on land, on islands, in water and underground. The environmental effects were unimaginable. Regulate that.
  - quasse 6y ago
    It's hard to say whether you're commenting in good faith, but ... World leaders did work to do exactly that, on a global scale. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partial_Nuclear_Test_Ban_Treaty https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partial_Nuclear_Test_Ban_Treat...
- kilo_bravo_3 6y ago
  Don't make fun of libertarians on Hacker News. The entitled, privileged, incapable of empathy, ignorant of the reality of the world around them, libertarian Tech Bros will get very angry with you. They will then try to eradicate your impure thoughts by downvoting you to the point that your comments are flagged or hidden-- while simultaneously criticizing this tactic whenever it is used against them elsewhere.
vaccinator 6y ago
I would make sure that it sunk too if I was dumping toxic stuff in the ocean... That is what BP did when they had that huge oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico... The dispersant (Corexit[1]) that they used to sink the oil was even more toxic then the oil itself, but at least it hid the mess. 1. https://www.motherjones.com/environment/2015/04/bp-corexit-deepwater-horizon-epa-dispersant/ https://www.motherjones.com/environment/2015/04/bp-corexit-d...
- hanniabu 6y ago
  I'm still amazed they're able to use that stuff
- sschueller 6y ago
  Corexit was a way bigger crime than the oil spill itself and a huge amount of profit was made selling the chemical. Discusting.
  - vaccinator 6y ago
    I still boycott BP, to this day. But I am probably a minority. In some areas in Florida, they purchased most gas stations after the spill happened, so it is sometime not easy to avoid them.
    - the_pwner224 6y ago
      I didn't bother boycotting BP because I assumed that all the big oil companies are similarly corrupt, put profit over the environment to the same degree, cover up their incidents, etc. BP is just the one that got unlucky and had a PR disaster about it. The article mentioned above implies that Corexit is commonly used - so nothing special about BP here. > Corexit is a go-to product for energy companies like BP when they’re dealing with massive spills. Wikipedia shows that BP's usage was by a very wide margin the largest use of Corexit, so I suppose I'm going to stop buying BP too. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corexit#Use https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corexit#Use
      - 6y ago

1propionyl 6y ago

See? This is why we don't need environmental regulations. The market will regulate itself if externalities are properly priced in! (Just pay no mind to how those externalities might be systematically priced and how penalties might be retroactively enforced. If you do you're a freedom-hating socialist!)

faitswulff 6y ago
> A pilot experiment more than a decade ago to bury the DDT [at the Palos Verdes superfund site] under a thick cap of clean sand showed mixed results. Then sampling in 2009 suggested that most of the DDT had mysteriously vanished — prompting a burst of headlines and more internal paralysis. The longtime project manager unexpectedly retired, and many of the scientists who had dedicated decades of their careers to the chemical have also either retired or moved on. The fact that DDT outlasted the scientists' careers is another strike (among many) against untrammeled libertarian free market thinking.
- 1propionyl 6y ago
  Ah, so the front fell off. In that case the DDT was just transported outside of the environment. There's nothing there, except water, and fish, and birds. (In case it isn't clear to anyone, this is heavy sarcasm and a reference to a well known satirical skit.)
  - mercer 6y ago
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3m5qxZm_JqM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3m5qxZm_JqM
refurb 6y ago
That's a silly comment considering it was the gov't who has done a shit-ton of ocean dumping in the past (not this case, but others). Who will regulate the government?
- amcoastal 6y ago
  The people. People like me, and I would hope you, would demand the government pass laws to not do these things.
  - yeezul 6y ago
    And how exactly are you asking your government to pass those laws?
    - hanniabu 6y ago
      Through voting and protests. If those don't work then there's also other avenues.
nickpp 6y ago
After the 2nd world war, governments all over the world exploded atomic ordinance on land, on islands, in water and underground. The environmental effects were unimaginable. Regulate that.
- quasse 6y ago
  It's hard to say whether you're commenting in good faith, but ... World leaders did work to do exactly that, on a global scale. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partial_Nuclear_Test_Ban_Treaty https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partial_Nuclear_Test_Ban_Treat...
kilo_bravo_3 6y ago
Don't make fun of libertarians on Hacker News. The entitled, privileged, incapable of empathy, ignorant of the reality of the world around them, libertarian Tech Bros will get very angry with you. They will then try to eradicate your impure thoughts by downvoting you to the point that your comments are flagged or hidden-- while simultaneously criticizing this tactic whenever it is used against them elsewhere.

vaccinator 6y ago

I would make sure that it sunk too if I was dumping toxic stuff in the ocean... That is what BP did when they had that huge oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico... The dispersant (Corexit[1]) that they used to sink the oil was even more toxic then the oil itself, but at least it hid the mess. 1. https://www.motherjones.com/environment/2015/04/bp-corexit-deepwater-horizon-epa-dispersant/ https://www.motherjones.com/environment/2015/04/bp-corexit-d...

hanniabu 6y ago
I'm still amazed they're able to use that stuff
sschueller 6y ago
Corexit was a way bigger crime than the oil spill itself and a huge amount of profit was made selling the chemical. Discusting.
- vaccinator 6y ago
  I still boycott BP, to this day. But I am probably a minority. In some areas in Florida, they purchased most gas stations after the spill happened, so it is sometime not easy to avoid them.
  - the_pwner224 6y ago
    I didn't bother boycotting BP because I assumed that all the big oil companies are similarly corrupt, put profit over the environment to the same degree, cover up their incidents, etc. BP is just the one that got unlucky and had a PR disaster about it. The article mentioned above implies that Corexit is commonly used - so nothing special about BP here. > Corexit is a go-to product for energy companies like BP when they’re dealing with massive spills. Wikipedia shows that BP's usage was by a very wide margin the largest use of Corexit, so I suppose I'm going to stop buying BP too. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corexit#Use https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corexit#Use
    - 6y ago