4 ms·

Mmhmm. I said it’s unfair. Again I don’t see how reiterating that Hunter Biden probably got some jobs because of his name proves the more salacious allegations

Mmhmm. I said it’s unfair. Again I don’t see how reiterating that Hunter Biden probably got some jobs because of his name proves the more salacious allegations that were the center of the story...

luckylion 6y ago
It doesn't, of course. Just as Mercedes paying Chinese princelings millions doesn't prove that there's corruption in China.
- chowchowchow 6y ago
  Well there’s other evidence of that! And the trouble here is the evidence from the story is not verified (the FBI has not confirmed its HB’s laptop, has it? The screenshots of the Russian blackberry seem... dubious...). And that’s the sort of thing that most news organizations would gate reporting on. I do agree it’s a bit strange for Twitter to step in and try to apply editorial standards where NYP didn’t when they otherwise disclaim responsibilities of being a publisher. I dunno; there’s an interesting discussion here if you can tone down the fire in your belly about conspiracies.
  - luckylion 6y ago
    > And that’s the sort of thing that most news organizations would gate reporting on. I don't think that's true. The Steele Dossier ("Trump pays Russian Hookers in Moscow to pee on him") wasn't treated special in any way, and it was much more questionable at the time than this story (where the unclear part is what they got for their bribes, not whether they payed his son for access to the VP). Of course, one argument might be "we've learned from our mistakes", but I believe that's a bit too obvious. > I dunno; there’s an interesting discussion here if you can tone down the fire in your belly about conspiracies. I don't think it needs a conspiracy theory, the coordination was very public. That there's political corruption in the US is also not news, it's the reason why children of politicians are making giant sums of money, politicians being paid tens to hundreds of thousands of dollars to give a speech etc. That's normal, there's not much to be found, I believe. Discussion of the suppression is not encouraged here: even a story about the suppression of the story was pretty much immediately suppressed on HN.
    - chowchowchow 6y ago
      You’re making my point aren’t you? You think the NYP story is as reputable as the dossier ? All the same, I don’t know of any newspapers which published stories treating the dossier as a source. As an object of the story, IE this thing exists, yes. As corroboration: please share if you have any. Actually I think what happened is Rudy etc got a little too desperate and excited and blundered tactically: surfacing the contents of the hard drive as continual leaks, like the DNC emails, would’ve allowed for a similar dynamic to 2016. Wouldn’t have mattered politically if the contents were real or not. By reaching and trying to drop the story as “real news,” the dubiousness of the source material got thrust directly into the spotlight. Blaming twitter, liberals, or whoever, for their poor smear tactics is just a coping mechanism at this point if you ask me.
      - luckylion 6y ago
        > You’re making my point aren’t you? You think the NYP story is as reputable as the dossier? My impression is that it's less made up than the juicy parts of the dossier. The dossier contained more truth though, but it was lame stuff that nobody cared about or reported on. > As an object of the story, IE this thing exists, yes. That's just moving goal posts. It's essentially "Now, I'm not claiming A did Z, but I hear a lot of people saying that A did Z. Did A do Z? What do you think, dear viewer?" Of course they're running the story, even if they throw a "this hasn't been independently confirmed" in the footer. That's the beauty about propaganda, you don't need to claim that it's true for the effect to be achieved.
        chowchowchow 6y ago
        Uhh, there has been plenty of coverage about the existence of the laptop qualified with that it’s unverified. What’s your beef? https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/22/us/politics/hunter-biden-laptop.html https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/22/us/politics/hunter-biden-...

luckylion 6y ago

It doesn't, of course. Just as Mercedes paying Chinese princelings millions doesn't prove that there's corruption in China.

chowchowchow 6y ago
Well there’s other evidence of that! And the trouble here is the evidence from the story is not verified (the FBI has not confirmed its HB’s laptop, has it? The screenshots of the Russian blackberry seem... dubious...). And that’s the sort of thing that most news organizations would gate reporting on. I do agree it’s a bit strange for Twitter to step in and try to apply editorial standards where NYP didn’t when they otherwise disclaim responsibilities of being a publisher. I dunno; there’s an interesting discussion here if you can tone down the fire in your belly about conspiracies.
- luckylion 6y ago
  > And that’s the sort of thing that most news organizations would gate reporting on. I don't think that's true. The Steele Dossier ("Trump pays Russian Hookers in Moscow to pee on him") wasn't treated special in any way, and it was much more questionable at the time than this story (where the unclear part is what they got for their bribes, not whether they payed his son for access to the VP). Of course, one argument might be "we've learned from our mistakes", but I believe that's a bit too obvious. > I dunno; there’s an interesting discussion here if you can tone down the fire in your belly about conspiracies. I don't think it needs a conspiracy theory, the coordination was very public. That there's political corruption in the US is also not news, it's the reason why children of politicians are making giant sums of money, politicians being paid tens to hundreds of thousands of dollars to give a speech etc. That's normal, there's not much to be found, I believe. Discussion of the suppression is not encouraged here: even a story about the suppression of the story was pretty much immediately suppressed on HN.
  - chowchowchow 6y ago
    You’re making my point aren’t you? You think the NYP story is as reputable as the dossier ? All the same, I don’t know of any newspapers which published stories treating the dossier as a source. As an object of the story, IE this thing exists, yes. As corroboration: please share if you have any. Actually I think what happened is Rudy etc got a little too desperate and excited and blundered tactically: surfacing the contents of the hard drive as continual leaks, like the DNC emails, would’ve allowed for a similar dynamic to 2016. Wouldn’t have mattered politically if the contents were real or not. By reaching and trying to drop the story as “real news,” the dubiousness of the source material got thrust directly into the spotlight. Blaming twitter, liberals, or whoever, for their poor smear tactics is just a coping mechanism at this point if you ask me.
    - luckylion 6y ago
      > You’re making my point aren’t you? You think the NYP story is as reputable as the dossier? My impression is that it's less made up than the juicy parts of the dossier. The dossier contained more truth though, but it was lame stuff that nobody cared about or reported on. > As an object of the story, IE this thing exists, yes. That's just moving goal posts. It's essentially "Now, I'm not claiming A did Z, but I hear a lot of people saying that A did Z. Did A do Z? What do you think, dear viewer?" Of course they're running the story, even if they throw a "this hasn't been independently confirmed" in the footer. That's the beauty about propaganda, you don't need to claim that it's true for the effect to be achieved.
      - chowchowchow 6y ago
        Uhh, there has been plenty of coverage about the existence of the laptop qualified with that it’s unverified. What’s your beef? https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/22/us/politics/hunter-biden-laptop.html https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/22/us/politics/hunter-biden-...