7 ms·

I’m a beekeeper and every passing year it becomes harder to keep my colonies alive. I’m really glad that we’re taking this threat seriously, because we don’t ne

by yawz 6y ago

I’m a beekeeper and every passing year it becomes harder to keep my colonies alive. I’m really glad that we’re taking this threat seriously, because we don’t need one more problem on our list of things that kill our bees. While I’m at it, please allow me to remind everyone that there are thousands of solitary bee species in the world. They are the ones that go extinct or in real danger compared to our honey bees. There are many struggling beekeepers like me in the world, and we’re doing our best to keep our bees alive. But thousands of species are without keepers and they are dying. Please be gentle to the nature. Let them live. (Edit: wondering how you can help, here's what I humbly suggested below in another comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24889023 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24889023)

RyanOD 6y ago
In addition, do what you can to support bees. Here are some simple suggestions from Nat Geo. https://www.nationalgeographic.com/news/2015/05/150524-bees-pollinators-animals-science-gardens-plants/ https://www.nationalgeographic.com/news/2015/05/150524-bees-...
- coliveira 6y ago
  This is an example of typical modern thinking that believes we can solve problems such as global warming and bee extinction by doing individual actions. This is completely nonsense. Either we do this as a public policy or there is no solution.
  - NateEag 6y ago
    Your comment is an example of typical programmer thinking that says "only a perfect solution is worth releasing". I have been guilty of that error countless times. An individual's actions will not solve a society's woes, but they don't need to. If they help a little bit where they are, they can be worth doing. Furthermore, individuals trying to help does not preclude larger-scale solutions. The people attempting individual actions could even contribute to the larger-scale or policy-based solutions.
    - coliveira 6y ago
      I am not advocating for a "perfect solution or nothing". I advocate for solutions based on public policy, even if they're partial. But I object to individual solutions, because they're no solution at all. It doesn't matter how many people do little actions, if there are a few big actors (say multinational corporations) exploiting and polluting the environment, the result is worse than zero! It is just like taking as aspirin to "help cure" a cancer that is destroying the body. And in fact focusing on doing these little things is a net negative, because it distracts from the big actions that need to be taken to fix an urgent problem.
      - Nzen 6y ago
        This worldview discounts the political awareness that such actions can foster. Someone who replaced their crabgrass lawn with native meadow has a daily embodiment of their value system. When such a person hears about murder hornets, is this person somehow less likely to contact his/her representatives about the issue than the person who kept a typical lawn, in your assessment ? That's the only way I can see this as a net negative, rather than neutral or trivially positive. Or, given that the described standpoint suggests I have enough attention for either planting a meadow lawn or supporting 'big action', why are you wasting it telling us about this, instead of naming names of the big actors to write to our representatives about and avoid electing representatives that hold a favorable position toward them ?
      - NateEag 6y ago
        Nzen already responded to this pretty thoroughly. I'll just add two points: 1) Individual good actions virtually never outweigh large-scale bad actions, but the world is actually worse off if individuals do not take those little positive actions. Little polluter + big polluter yields more pollution than big polluter. 2) Taking the small positive actions is actually a lot of what helps people work on the huge, difficult problems. Humans are more effective when our psychology is a unified self rather than in conflict with itself, and taking small, positive concrete steps helps us keep ourselves in alignment with our big-picture goals and ideals. I guess both of those fit into the abstract observation that you're bifurcating - people don't have to choose between individual concrete actions and contributing to policy efforts and other high-level approaches. By all means, if you see someone explicitly saying they choose one at the expense of the other, say something. When they don't say that, though, don't assume that's what they're doing.
  - wizzwizz4 6y ago
    Individuals can make the problem get worse more slowly, which can buy time for public policy to come into effect.
roughly 6y ago
I've read a number of articles describing the stressors on bee colonies, but I'm interested in your take - what do you see as the primary factors affecting your colonies?
- yawz 6y ago
  I live in place where winters are harsh. Colonies need to be well-prepared to successfully overwinter. They are amazingly robust when they are healthy, but anything that affects this preparation can easily be deadly over a period of time. There can be many reasons. The Varroa Mite [0] is one that we have to constantly fight against, these days. The mites don't kill the entire colony, but weakens it so much that the colony can't overwinter. Or there viruses [1] that deform the bees' wings that can debilitate the colony. There are also other problems that we don't see where I live, but other beekeepers have to fight, such as the Small Hive Beetle [2]. I suspect because of the ongoing wildfires and poor air quality in this region, one of my queens stopped laying eggs mid-summer, at a time when she normally lays 1,500-2,000 eggs every day. I had to replace her. I don't know if that colony is going to survive the winter. Some other colonies had similar problems. Yesterday a beekeeper friend told me she lost a colony and she has another one on the brink of collapsing. Then, we also don't know who is using what type of pesticides around here. Bees can forage anywhere in the 2-3 mile radius. It's near impossible for me to know what's going on in such a wide area. It's a constant uphill battle. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Varroa_destructor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Varroa_destructor [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deformed_wing_virus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deformed_wing_virus [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small_hive_beetle https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small_hive_beetle
  - roughly 6y ago
    Thanks, I appreciate the response. Are things like the beetles and virus new introductions to the area, or is it just a confluence of factors that are hitting harder now? I'd also heard (many years ago) that, while the colonies can collapse, the bees normally reproduce quickly enough that you don't see much of a net loss in colony counts year-over-year - how do you see that? My impression is that the bee populations have been remarkably resilient year over year, but whenever I see this kind of stress-and-recovery cycle, I worry that there's a tipping point - many systems seem Fine under stress until they overwhelm their recovery mechanism and collapse catastrophically.
xwdv 6y ago
What will happen when bees go extinct? Edit: I don’t understand the vicious pointless downvotes over this question.
- aardvarkr 6y ago
  Not a beekeeper but it’s pretty easy to connect the dots from bee extinction to ecological collapse. No pollinators leads to decreased germination which leads to less food for the lower levels of the food chain and on and on
  - sosborn 6y ago
    Bees aren't the only pollinators out there. Yes, they are super important, but others exist. https://www.zmescience.com/ecology/animals-ecology/incredible-pollinating-animals-bees/ https://www.zmescience.com/ecology/animals-ecology/incredibl...
    - whymauri 6y ago
      Aren't the others also at risk?
      - yawz 6y ago
        That's a good point. We are not being bad to honey bees or bees alone. We are killing everything.
  - BigBubbleButt 6y ago
    > Not a beekeeper but it’s pretty easy to connect the dots from bee extinction to ecological collapse. How is that an easy connection? Your argument essentially says without bees then nature as we know it falls apart catastrophically - I am incredulous you could interpret this as obvious. Species go extinct all the time and yet Earth is still doing just fine, apart from the damage humans are doing to it. > No pollinators Bees are not the only pollinators > leads to decreased germination A decrease is not the same as elimination > which leads to less food A decrease is not the same as elimination > for the lower levels of the food chain and on and on Your argument is a about knock-on effects, which certainly exist. But you seem to think if any point in the chain breaks, it leads to ecological collapse. Why do you assume nature is so fragile? I am not a biologist and maybe bees are special or there is something I do not understand, but I certainly don't think it's an obvious conclusion.
armedpacifist 6y ago
It seems to me that beekeeping results in direct competition with solitary bees and other pollinating insects as well.
dmos62 6y ago
Can you give advice or direct us to where we could learn what we can do to actively help bee populations around us?
- wbl 6y ago
  Plant wildflowers.
- yawz 6y ago
  If you have access to gardens, you can plant bee-friendly flowering plants according to your region's climate. You can learn about the wild bees in your region and understand what natural resources they thrive on. Some of them are so specialized that they can easily be threatened by the loss of habitat. Some of the bee "houses" can become great activities for children. For example kids can build Mason Bee houses and watch them attract bees. Supporting local beekeepers and bee-friendly farmers. By trying to keep an immaculate lawn or mosquito-free areas, most of us sacrifice the local insect population including various bees that are affected by those pesticides. By spreading awareness, but also starting your own hive is a great hobby and it's quite affordable if you have the time. You don't even have to have them in your garden or balcony. You can speak to local farmers, and they can be happy to host your hive on their property. That's how I started.
  - marmaduke 6y ago
    > plant bee-friendly flowering plants according to your region's climate. I have a bit of garden but in the middle of a residential district of a city. Do I have any chance to attract bees or is > starting your own hive the only way?
    - mod 6y ago
      They'll come.
    - snuxoll 6y ago
      I have a good amount of bee-friendly flowers that are visited daily in the spring and summer by our local bee populations, it is very much “build it and they will come”. If I had a bigger yard I would host a couple hives of my own, I love just sitting out in the flowers in the warmer weather and watching them forage.
throwanem 6y ago
Native solitary bees are going extinct and in danger largely because of being outcompeted by invasive European honeybees. They're not the only invasive hymenopteran established in the Nearctic, but thanks to human effort they are by far the most prolific.

by yawz 6y ago

RyanOD 6y ago

In addition, do what you can to support bees. Here are some simple suggestions from Nat Geo. https://www.nationalgeographic.com/news/2015/05/150524-bees-pollinators-animals-science-gardens-plants/ https://www.nationalgeographic.com/news/2015/05/150524-bees-...

coliveira 6y ago
This is an example of typical modern thinking that believes we can solve problems such as global warming and bee extinction by doing individual actions. This is completely nonsense. Either we do this as a public policy or there is no solution.
- NateEag 6y ago
  Your comment is an example of typical programmer thinking that says "only a perfect solution is worth releasing". I have been guilty of that error countless times. An individual's actions will not solve a society's woes, but they don't need to. If they help a little bit where they are, they can be worth doing. Furthermore, individuals trying to help does not preclude larger-scale solutions. The people attempting individual actions could even contribute to the larger-scale or policy-based solutions.
  - coliveira 6y ago
    I am not advocating for a "perfect solution or nothing". I advocate for solutions based on public policy, even if they're partial. But I object to individual solutions, because they're no solution at all. It doesn't matter how many people do little actions, if there are a few big actors (say multinational corporations) exploiting and polluting the environment, the result is worse than zero! It is just like taking as aspirin to "help cure" a cancer that is destroying the body. And in fact focusing on doing these little things is a net negative, because it distracts from the big actions that need to be taken to fix an urgent problem.
    - Nzen 6y ago
      This worldview discounts the political awareness that such actions can foster. Someone who replaced their crabgrass lawn with native meadow has a daily embodiment of their value system. When such a person hears about murder hornets, is this person somehow less likely to contact his/her representatives about the issue than the person who kept a typical lawn, in your assessment ? That's the only way I can see this as a net negative, rather than neutral or trivially positive. Or, given that the described standpoint suggests I have enough attention for either planting a meadow lawn or supporting 'big action', why are you wasting it telling us about this, instead of naming names of the big actors to write to our representatives about and avoid electing representatives that hold a favorable position toward them ?
    - NateEag 6y ago
      Nzen already responded to this pretty thoroughly. I'll just add two points: 1) Individual good actions virtually never outweigh large-scale bad actions, but the world is actually worse off if individuals do not take those little positive actions. Little polluter + big polluter yields more pollution than big polluter. 2) Taking the small positive actions is actually a lot of what helps people work on the huge, difficult problems. Humans are more effective when our psychology is a unified self rather than in conflict with itself, and taking small, positive concrete steps helps us keep ourselves in alignment with our big-picture goals and ideals. I guess both of those fit into the abstract observation that you're bifurcating - people don't have to choose between individual concrete actions and contributing to policy efforts and other high-level approaches. By all means, if you see someone explicitly saying they choose one at the expense of the other, say something. When they don't say that, though, don't assume that's what they're doing.
- wizzwizz4 6y ago
  Individuals can make the problem get worse more slowly, which can buy time for public policy to come into effect.

roughly 6y ago

I've read a number of articles describing the stressors on bee colonies, but I'm interested in your take - what do you see as the primary factors affecting your colonies?

yawz 6y ago
I live in place where winters are harsh. Colonies need to be well-prepared to successfully overwinter. They are amazingly robust when they are healthy, but anything that affects this preparation can easily be deadly over a period of time. There can be many reasons. The Varroa Mite [0] is one that we have to constantly fight against, these days. The mites don't kill the entire colony, but weakens it so much that the colony can't overwinter. Or there viruses [1] that deform the bees' wings that can debilitate the colony. There are also other problems that we don't see where I live, but other beekeepers have to fight, such as the Small Hive Beetle [2]. I suspect because of the ongoing wildfires and poor air quality in this region, one of my queens stopped laying eggs mid-summer, at a time when she normally lays 1,500-2,000 eggs every day. I had to replace her. I don't know if that colony is going to survive the winter. Some other colonies had similar problems. Yesterday a beekeeper friend told me she lost a colony and she has another one on the brink of collapsing. Then, we also don't know who is using what type of pesticides around here. Bees can forage anywhere in the 2-3 mile radius. It's near impossible for me to know what's going on in such a wide area. It's a constant uphill battle. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Varroa_destructor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Varroa_destructor [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deformed_wing_virus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deformed_wing_virus [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small_hive_beetle https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small_hive_beetle
- roughly 6y ago
  Thanks, I appreciate the response. Are things like the beetles and virus new introductions to the area, or is it just a confluence of factors that are hitting harder now? I'd also heard (many years ago) that, while the colonies can collapse, the bees normally reproduce quickly enough that you don't see much of a net loss in colony counts year-over-year - how do you see that? My impression is that the bee populations have been remarkably resilient year over year, but whenever I see this kind of stress-and-recovery cycle, I worry that there's a tipping point - many systems seem Fine under stress until they overwhelm their recovery mechanism and collapse catastrophically.

xwdv 6y ago

What will happen when bees go extinct? Edit: I don’t understand the vicious pointless downvotes over this question.

aardvarkr 6y ago
Not a beekeeper but it’s pretty easy to connect the dots from bee extinction to ecological collapse. No pollinators leads to decreased germination which leads to less food for the lower levels of the food chain and on and on
- sosborn 6y ago
  Bees aren't the only pollinators out there. Yes, they are super important, but others exist. https://www.zmescience.com/ecology/animals-ecology/incredible-pollinating-animals-bees/ https://www.zmescience.com/ecology/animals-ecology/incredibl...
  - whymauri 6y ago
    Aren't the others also at risk?
    - yawz 6y ago
      That's a good point. We are not being bad to honey bees or bees alone. We are killing everything.
- BigBubbleButt 6y ago
  > Not a beekeeper but it’s pretty easy to connect the dots from bee extinction to ecological collapse. How is that an easy connection? Your argument essentially says without bees then nature as we know it falls apart catastrophically - I am incredulous you could interpret this as obvious. Species go extinct all the time and yet Earth is still doing just fine, apart from the damage humans are doing to it. > No pollinators Bees are not the only pollinators > leads to decreased germination A decrease is not the same as elimination > which leads to less food A decrease is not the same as elimination > for the lower levels of the food chain and on and on Your argument is a about knock-on effects, which certainly exist. But you seem to think if any point in the chain breaks, it leads to ecological collapse. Why do you assume nature is so fragile? I am not a biologist and maybe bees are special or there is something I do not understand, but I certainly don't think it's an obvious conclusion.

armedpacifist 6y ago

It seems to me that beekeeping results in direct competition with solitary bees and other pollinating insects as well.

dmos62 6y ago

Can you give advice or direct us to where we could learn what we can do to actively help bee populations around us?

wbl 6y ago
Plant wildflowers.
yawz 6y ago
If you have access to gardens, you can plant bee-friendly flowering plants according to your region's climate. You can learn about the wild bees in your region and understand what natural resources they thrive on. Some of them are so specialized that they can easily be threatened by the loss of habitat. Some of the bee "houses" can become great activities for children. For example kids can build Mason Bee houses and watch them attract bees. Supporting local beekeepers and bee-friendly farmers. By trying to keep an immaculate lawn or mosquito-free areas, most of us sacrifice the local insect population including various bees that are affected by those pesticides. By spreading awareness, but also starting your own hive is a great hobby and it's quite affordable if you have the time. You don't even have to have them in your garden or balcony. You can speak to local farmers, and they can be happy to host your hive on their property. That's how I started.
- marmaduke 6y ago
  > plant bee-friendly flowering plants according to your region's climate. I have a bit of garden but in the middle of a residential district of a city. Do I have any chance to attract bees or is > starting your own hive the only way?
  - mod 6y ago
    They'll come.
  - snuxoll 6y ago
    I have a good amount of bee-friendly flowers that are visited daily in the spring and summer by our local bee populations, it is very much “build it and they will come”. If I had a bigger yard I would host a couple hives of my own, I love just sitting out in the flowers in the warmer weather and watching them forage.

throwanem 6y ago

Native solitary bees are going extinct and in danger largely because of being outcompeted by invasive European honeybees. They're not the only invasive hymenopteran established in the Nearctic, but thanks to human effort they are by far the most prolific.