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Also, nitpick, nobody's blocking Persians. I'm not Persian but if I go to Iran I bet I'm blocked too. I'm strongly opposed to these sanctions, and I also think

Also, nitpick, nobody's blocking Persians. I'm not Persian but if I go to Iran I bet I'm blocked too. I'm strongly opposed to these sanctions, and I also think GitLab should've given people notice so they could get their data out. But I'm not sure it's a good place to pull the racism card.

AsyncAwait 6y ago
I agree it's not racism on GitLab's part, but the U.S. officials behind these sanctions themselves do use phrases like that they want to 'choke Iran's economy', that is in the middle of a pandemic where people's respiratory systems are at risk, it certainly doesn't look good on their part. Also worth noting that GitLab has previously banned hiring from China/Russia, so it's no stranger to blanket bans of questionable nature. 1 - https://www.zdnet.com/article/gitlab-considers-ban-on-new-hires-in-china-and-russia-due-to-espionage-fears https://www.zdnet.com/article/gitlab-considers-ban-on-new-hi...
- microcolonel 6y ago
  There is nothing racist about economic sanctions against a country which is in active conflict with our armed forces outside of their borders, which is actively engaged in psy-ops to destabilize American society. Economic sanctions against America would not be racism against scots/germans/west africans or whatever. You can argue against sanctions on all sorts of grounds, but the flimsiest is claiming that they're racist.
  - AsyncAwait 6y ago
    > There is nothing racist about economic sanctions against a country which is in active conflict with our armed forces outside of their borders I think that singing about how you want to destroy the country, how you want to choke it etc. do prove racist tendencies. As for armed forces acting outside of borders, you cannot claim that U.S. armed forces are any more 'authorized' to be in these places than Iranian ones, can you? So in the end, it comes down to nothing more than the U.S. having the ability to implement these sanctions and Iran not, there's no 'principles' in it, just geo-politics. What is remarkable however is that this pandemic is a uniquely challenging situation even for countries not under sanctions, so placing new sanctions on the country, as was recently done, is plain inhumane.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
- ReptileMan 6y ago
  >I agree it's not racism on GitLab's part, but the U.S. officials behind these sanctions themselves do use phrases like that they want to 'choke Iran's economy', that is in the middle of a pandemic where people's respiratory systems are at risk, it certainly doesn't look good on their part. Oh come on. That is not scraping the barrel but the bare metal underneath for offense. And most people die of hearth attacks anyway.
- marcinzm 6y ago
  >Also worth noting that GitLab has previously banned hiring from China/Russia, so it's no stranger to blanket bans of questionable nature. I wouldn't consider not hiring from countries with aggressive foreign policies and non-democratic governments that use coercion on their own citizens (including employees of said company) as questionable. GitLab's main job is to protect it's company and it's customers not to try to build some sort of utopian post-reality civilization.
  - AsyncAwait 6y ago
    > countries with aggressive foreign policies If we go by that logic, the U.S. would get on that list. > non-democratic governments that use coercion on their own citizens If that was indeed the standard to go by, I'd agree, but the list would then need to be much, much longer and possibly include even some traditionally democratic countries like Australia who have an actual law where they can force employees to secretly install backdoors. Saudi Arabia infiltrated Twitter and compromised some of its employees to obtain info on regime critics that could endanger their lives, as just another example. The list would by these metrics include well over half the world.
    - marcinzm 6y ago
      >If we go by that logic, the U.S. would get on that list. I put an AND in my statement for a reason, please don't cherry pick parts of sentences. >The list would by these metrics include well over half the world. That's like saying that if you don't want to die you should live in a cocoon and never leave the house, rather than just making sure to avoid the most dangerous activities. GitLab is blocking the countries it sees as the most risky and carry the least cost in blocking. I'm sure their lawyers would love to block half the world but that would cost them too much.
      - amaccuish 6y ago
        > I put an AND in my statement for a reason, please don't cherry pick parts of sentences. As a non US-citizen, I don't really care if the US is democratic or not. People have voted and continue to vote for terrible things. What matters is what a country does. So actually the US would certainly be on that list. Unless your argument is, it's not evil if we all voted for it?
- navaati 6y ago
  They also ban hires from France FWIW, but that's because they wouldn't touch our labour code with a 10-foot pole haha.
  - doomlaser 6y ago
    I didn't realize until today that Gitlab is entirely remote and has been since it was founded (long before covid) https://www.inc.com/cameron-albert-deitch/gitlab-tips-remote-workforce.html https://www.inc.com/cameron-albert-deitch/gitlab-tips-remote...
  - voltagex_ 6y ago
    Wait, what?
  - Tijdreiziger 6y ago
    Wait, I was under the impression that GitLab was originally a Dutch company (it appears to be American now)? Are the labor laws in France that much more lax than in the Netherlands?
dessant 6y ago
Some companies will block you despite having no legal obligation, because it's more convenient, than to apply the law in a sensible manner. GitLab is apparently such a company. > 118. I have a client that is in Iran to visit a relative. Do I need to restrict the account? > No. As long as you are satisfied that the client is not ordinarily resident in Iran, then the account does not need to be restricted. https://home.treasury.gov/policy-issues/financial-sanctions/faqs/topic/1551 https://home.treasury.gov/policy-issues/financial-sanctions/...
- diebeforei485 6y ago
  This refers to bank accounts. A restricted account would mean the account can be closed and cashed out, but not used in other ways.
  - dessant 6y ago
    The same principle applies to GitLab in regards to account closure, they don't have to close an account without any interaction because the user has at some point logged in from an Iranian IP address, and they can preemptively restrict an account and ask for proof of residence.
    - diebeforei485 6y ago
      Sure, but someone is being blocked while traveling temporarily, they can log in again once they travel back to their place of residence. I don't see why geo-blocking is unreasonable.
mirekrusin 6y ago
Fossil on something like ipfs/torrent sounds like a great solution (where tickets etc/the whole thing is embedded in the repo itself). Even for enterprise projects where we're hit by outages from time to time it feels like a great solution. What if sanctioned/blocked account has publicly used repository?

AsyncAwait 6y ago

I agree it's not racism on GitLab's part, but the U.S. officials behind these sanctions themselves do use phrases like that they want to 'choke Iran's economy', that is in the middle of a pandemic where people's respiratory systems are at risk, it certainly doesn't look good on their part. Also worth noting that GitLab has previously banned hiring from China/Russia, so it's no stranger to blanket bans of questionable nature. 1 - https://www.zdnet.com/article/gitlab-considers-ban-on-new-hires-in-china-and-russia-due-to-espionage-fears https://www.zdnet.com/article/gitlab-considers-ban-on-new-hi...

microcolonel 6y ago
There is nothing racist about economic sanctions against a country which is in active conflict with our armed forces outside of their borders, which is actively engaged in psy-ops to destabilize American society. Economic sanctions against America would not be racism against scots/germans/west africans or whatever. You can argue against sanctions on all sorts of grounds, but the flimsiest is claiming that they're racist.
- AsyncAwait 6y ago
  > There is nothing racist about economic sanctions against a country which is in active conflict with our armed forces outside of their borders I think that singing about how you want to destroy the country, how you want to choke it etc. do prove racist tendencies. As for armed forces acting outside of borders, you cannot claim that U.S. armed forces are any more 'authorized' to be in these places than Iranian ones, can you? So in the end, it comes down to nothing more than the U.S. having the ability to implement these sanctions and Iran not, there's no 'principles' in it, just geo-politics. What is remarkable however is that this pandemic is a uniquely challenging situation even for countries not under sanctions, so placing new sanctions on the country, as was recently done, is plain inhumane.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
ReptileMan 6y ago
>I agree it's not racism on GitLab's part, but the U.S. officials behind these sanctions themselves do use phrases like that they want to 'choke Iran's economy', that is in the middle of a pandemic where people's respiratory systems are at risk, it certainly doesn't look good on their part. Oh come on. That is not scraping the barrel but the bare metal underneath for offense. And most people die of hearth attacks anyway.
marcinzm 6y ago
>Also worth noting that GitLab has previously banned hiring from China/Russia, so it's no stranger to blanket bans of questionable nature. I wouldn't consider not hiring from countries with aggressive foreign policies and non-democratic governments that use coercion on their own citizens (including employees of said company) as questionable. GitLab's main job is to protect it's company and it's customers not to try to build some sort of utopian post-reality civilization.
- AsyncAwait 6y ago
  > countries with aggressive foreign policies If we go by that logic, the U.S. would get on that list. > non-democratic governments that use coercion on their own citizens If that was indeed the standard to go by, I'd agree, but the list would then need to be much, much longer and possibly include even some traditionally democratic countries like Australia who have an actual law where they can force employees to secretly install backdoors. Saudi Arabia infiltrated Twitter and compromised some of its employees to obtain info on regime critics that could endanger their lives, as just another example. The list would by these metrics include well over half the world.
  - marcinzm 6y ago
    >If we go by that logic, the U.S. would get on that list. I put an AND in my statement for a reason, please don't cherry pick parts of sentences. >The list would by these metrics include well over half the world. That's like saying that if you don't want to die you should live in a cocoon and never leave the house, rather than just making sure to avoid the most dangerous activities. GitLab is blocking the countries it sees as the most risky and carry the least cost in blocking. I'm sure their lawyers would love to block half the world but that would cost them too much.
    - amaccuish 6y ago
      > I put an AND in my statement for a reason, please don't cherry pick parts of sentences. As a non US-citizen, I don't really care if the US is democratic or not. People have voted and continue to vote for terrible things. What matters is what a country does. So actually the US would certainly be on that list. Unless your argument is, it's not evil if we all voted for it?
navaati 6y ago
They also ban hires from France FWIW, but that's because they wouldn't touch our labour code with a 10-foot pole haha.
- doomlaser 6y ago
  I didn't realize until today that Gitlab is entirely remote and has been since it was founded (long before covid) https://www.inc.com/cameron-albert-deitch/gitlab-tips-remote-workforce.html https://www.inc.com/cameron-albert-deitch/gitlab-tips-remote...
- voltagex_ 6y ago
  Wait, what?
- Tijdreiziger 6y ago
  Wait, I was under the impression that GitLab was originally a Dutch company (it appears to be American now)? Are the labor laws in France that much more lax than in the Netherlands?

dessant 6y ago

Some companies will block you despite having no legal obligation, because it's more convenient, than to apply the law in a sensible manner. GitLab is apparently such a company. > 118. I have a client that is in Iran to visit a relative. Do I need to restrict the account? > No. As long as you are satisfied that the client is not ordinarily resident in Iran, then the account does not need to be restricted. https://home.treasury.gov/policy-issues/financial-sanctions/faqs/topic/1551 https://home.treasury.gov/policy-issues/financial-sanctions/...

diebeforei485 6y ago
This refers to bank accounts. A restricted account would mean the account can be closed and cashed out, but not used in other ways.
- dessant 6y ago
  The same principle applies to GitLab in regards to account closure, they don't have to close an account without any interaction because the user has at some point logged in from an Iranian IP address, and they can preemptively restrict an account and ask for proof of residence.
  - diebeforei485 6y ago
    Sure, but someone is being blocked while traveling temporarily, they can log in again once they travel back to their place of residence. I don't see why geo-blocking is unreasonable.

mirekrusin 6y ago

Fossil on something like ipfs/torrent sounds like a great solution (where tickets etc/the whole thing is embedded in the repo itself). Even for enterprise projects where we're hit by outages from time to time it feels like a great solution. What if sanctioned/blocked account has publicly used repository?