5 ms·

What does the blockchain add to the equation beyond what the photo already does?

sebmellen 6y ago
The timestamp of the photo. This way we know that the photos were taken before transport, and the state of the car when it's dropped off should match the state of the car at pickup.
- pintxo 6y ago
  Wouldn't sending a copy of the photo to the owner prior to transportation be sufficient? Actually, why doesn't the owner take a picture himself? After all I could easily manipulate the picture before timestamping.
  - detaro 6y ago
    > Wouldn't sending a copy of the photo to the owner prior to transportation be sufficient? Doesn't protect against the owner saying you didn't send the photo, or that it didn't arrive in time, ... > Actually, why doesn't the owner take a picture himself? Because they're not present when the car gets transferred between transportation companies.
    - pintxo 6y ago
      > Doesn't protect against the owner saying you didn't send the photo, or that it didn't arrive in time, ... The owner could be required to send back a confirmation. But I agree, a trusted hash/timestamp service might provide better usability.
- root_axis 6y ago
  Nothing proves that the timestamp accurately reflects when the photo was taken or that the photo itself is even accurate. If I wanted to joy-ride one of these cars I'd simply do so before taking the photo. The odometer display can also be trivially modified for the sake of a photo (i.e. roll back the odo for a photo and then revert to accurate numbers after the photo)
  - technoplato 6y ago
    This has been the only comment I'm actually interested in seeing a response from parent commenter on.
    - UweSchmidt 6y ago
      There is no solution for the oracle problem: someone has to input the truth, and that entity can just run a database. End of story. People made insane money with Bitcoin, Ethereum and others. People then dropped lots of other "coins" that eventually no one cared about. "Blockchain as useful technology" is the story to sell the next "coin". Employing a couple of devs and funding a few blockchain startups is trivial money in this context, often sponsored by "believers" (who got rich in the early days) Blockchain tech comes with inescapable complexities and problems: bugs and security issues can't be fixed in blockchain programs. Any trivial action on the blockchain requires mining, i.e. the very thing that's done with specialized hardware in areas where energy is cheap. My last point seems to be tangential, but do try it yourself with a small project on a private Ethereum chain, using geth, web3.js, there are good tutorials out there. Usually when you try out a fancy new tech you "get it" after a while, but I definitively did NOT see any way this is feasible.
  - dejj 6y ago
    How do you undo any dents that may occur during a joyride though?
    - root_axis 6y ago
      I'm not sure what you're asking. If the possibility of dents were enough to prevent joyrides then the entire conversation would be moot, blockchain or otherwise.
  - poiuiopkj 6y ago
    The next entity in the supply chain would have an odometer that didn't match the picture that was previously posted. It limits who is possibly at fault to a minimum of one of two parties, which I'm sure could be narrowed down further by corroborating evidence. It highly discourages it because at the very least, you would be the first suspect with no real finger to point.

The timestamp of the photo. This way we know that the photos were taken before transport, and the state of the car when it's dropped off should match the state of the car at pickup.

pintxo 6y ago
Wouldn't sending a copy of the photo to the owner prior to transportation be sufficient? Actually, why doesn't the owner take a picture himself? After all I could easily manipulate the picture before timestamping.
- detaro 6y ago
  > Wouldn't sending a copy of the photo to the owner prior to transportation be sufficient? Doesn't protect against the owner saying you didn't send the photo, or that it didn't arrive in time, ... > Actually, why doesn't the owner take a picture himself? Because they're not present when the car gets transferred between transportation companies.
  - pintxo 6y ago
    > Doesn't protect against the owner saying you didn't send the photo, or that it didn't arrive in time, ... The owner could be required to send back a confirmation. But I agree, a trusted hash/timestamp service might provide better usability.
root_axis 6y ago
Nothing proves that the timestamp accurately reflects when the photo was taken or that the photo itself is even accurate. If I wanted to joy-ride one of these cars I'd simply do so before taking the photo. The odometer display can also be trivially modified for the sake of a photo (i.e. roll back the odo for a photo and then revert to accurate numbers after the photo)
- technoplato 6y ago
  This has been the only comment I'm actually interested in seeing a response from parent commenter on.
  - UweSchmidt 6y ago
    There is no solution for the oracle problem: someone has to input the truth, and that entity can just run a database. End of story. People made insane money with Bitcoin, Ethereum and others. People then dropped lots of other "coins" that eventually no one cared about. "Blockchain as useful technology" is the story to sell the next "coin". Employing a couple of devs and funding a few blockchain startups is trivial money in this context, often sponsored by "believers" (who got rich in the early days) Blockchain tech comes with inescapable complexities and problems: bugs and security issues can't be fixed in blockchain programs. Any trivial action on the blockchain requires mining, i.e. the very thing that's done with specialized hardware in areas where energy is cheap. My last point seems to be tangential, but do try it yourself with a small project on a private Ethereum chain, using geth, web3.js, there are good tutorials out there. Usually when you try out a fancy new tech you "get it" after a while, but I definitively did NOT see any way this is feasible.
- dejj 6y ago
  How do you undo any dents that may occur during a joyride though?
  - root_axis 6y ago
    I'm not sure what you're asking. If the possibility of dents were enough to prevent joyrides then the entire conversation would be moot, blockchain or otherwise.
- poiuiopkj 6y ago
  The next entity in the supply chain would have an odometer that didn't match the picture that was previously posted. It limits who is possibly at fault to a minimum of one of two parties, which I'm sure could be narrowed down further by corroborating evidence. It highly discourages it because at the very least, you would be the first suspect with no real finger to point.