4 ms·

I don't know what to say or describe my feelings after reading that article -- How can we help ?

by clubdorothe 6y ago

naderkhalil 6y ago
I wonder if calling our representatives can help
- missedthecue 6y ago
  What can they do?
  - smitty1e 6y ago
    Representatives help compile the political will to apply economic pressure. There are no magic wands here.
  - runarberg 6y ago
    The international community could do a lot more to stop this horror. International leaders could condemn this for a start. They could put sanctions on the chinese ruling class, or Chinese businesses, as well as exclude Chinese participation in international events (such as the Olympics). Your local representative could raise awareness to such measures to the ruling class in your country, and vote in favor for them in your national assembly. At the very least your local representative could call to shame any other member of the ruling class that is not publicly and vocally condemning this horror.
    - missedthecue 6y ago
      Have sanctions ever worked? They haven't worked on Cuba. They haven't worked on Venezuela. They haven't worked on Russia. They haven't worked on North Korea. They haven't worked anywhere I can think of.
      - Tiktaalik 6y ago
        South Africa.
      - gherkinnn 6y ago
        Neither in Iraq. Nor in Iran.
      - runarberg 6y ago
        The countries you picked as an example is a little curious. Sanctions against Russia were really weak and limited, I don’t think anybody had any intentions for them to work at all. The sanctions of Cuba and Venezuela (or embargo in the case of Cuba) were targeted against their autonomy, i.e. countries were not OK with their economic policies so they imposed the sanctions (which were more devastating then any action by the government in Cuba). In the case of Venezuela the sanctions are targeted against a democratically elected government in favor of an opposition that was never elected. The goal here is to abolish democracy, what do you expect the Venezuelan government to do? This leaves North Korea, which is a genuine example of sanctions not working (and in fact casing harm in them self, since the victims are often starving citizens). However threats of further sanctions have worked in the past to prevent North Korea from developing a nuclear weapons program (which they later developed anyway). So I’ll give you that one. But now let’s turn to South Africa. The Apartheid government was supported by many rich nations throughout the late 20th century. Their crimes got worse and worse over the years. Until the international community finally came together in the last decade of the century and imposed heavy sanctions, even excluded them from participating in cultural and sporting events. The apartheid government finally collapsed and South Africa got their first democratically elected precedent that represented a majority of the nation in 1994. But I don’t think it is fair to talk only about the failure of sanctions to actively work in this context, the alternative here (as per ancestor comment) is military intervention. I could just as easily come up with a list of countries where military intervention did not resolve anything (or left the country seriously damage): • Cuba • Libya • Syria • Afghanistan • Yemen • Somalia You could make the case for Rwanda, East Timor, Cambodia, or even Nazi Germany. But those cases are more nuanced than that, and claiming that military intervention was a “response that worked” would be an inexcusable simplification of how the events unfolded.
rglover 6y ago
Educate others. Share this information. Talk about it and get it into the public conversation.
bhaskara2 6y ago
Stop buying China made goods and educate your family members to do so as well. This is good starting point
- arwineap 6y ago
  Is that even possible? What is made in the US that doesn't buy raw materials or partially assembled materials from china?
  - ericd 6y ago
    Sounds like there might be demand for some certification that looks into the whole supply chain of a company, and can offer levels of “Made in the US” certification, bronze, silver, gold, platinum for 100% end to end. Similarly, it would be great for an estimate and certification of carbon emissions of the supply chain for each product.
    - gremlinsinc 6y ago
      Made in the USA is a bit...of a pipe dream. U.S. cost of living is higher, so prices for all products would skyrocket. However, there's MANY countries that are NOT China. We could instead certify products against supporting bad regimes, and using slave / prison labor in the supply chain.
      - ericd 6y ago
        For products where labor is a big input, yeah the delta is probably too high for most unless we get carbon taxes, tariffs, or some other factor that evens the field, but the US also supposedly has quite a bit of highly automated manufacturing. And the purpose is to allow people who place a premium on that to consider it. But yeah, it could also serve to give visibility into the breakdown of countries of origin, for those who just want to avoid sending money to countries they view as abusive.
  - themacguffinman 6y ago
    I doubt you can fully eliminate China-sourced products but looking at "TAA compliant" products is a start. TAA compliance is a US federal standard that guarantees a minimum level of manufacturing involvement in TAA countries [1], which is a list that does not include China. I'm not going to pretend I'm able to avoid China in all my purchasing decisions but I now do some research to avoid China-made or at least China-designed products. [1] https://gsa.federalschedules.com/resources/taa-designated-countries/ https://gsa.federalschedules.com/resources/taa-designated-co...
lmeyerov 6y ago
Vote
agent00f 6y ago
You can start by reading at least the wiki articles about the subjects in question instead of just US agitprop, for example what led to the crackdown. The Uighurs are seriously lucky this wasn't Murica they ran afoul of. It really is hilarious how easy the ostensibly "educated" tech class is manipulate same as the fox news audience.
- Gibbon1 6y ago
  One thing I never see mentioned was the US and it's allies used Uighur's as mercenaries in Syria.

I don't know what to say or describe my feelings after reading that article -- How can we help ?

naderkhalil 6y ago

I wonder if calling our representatives can help

missedthecue 6y ago
What can they do?
- smitty1e 6y ago
  Representatives help compile the political will to apply economic pressure. There are no magic wands here.
- runarberg 6y ago
  The international community could do a lot more to stop this horror. International leaders could condemn this for a start. They could put sanctions on the chinese ruling class, or Chinese businesses, as well as exclude Chinese participation in international events (such as the Olympics). Your local representative could raise awareness to such measures to the ruling class in your country, and vote in favor for them in your national assembly. At the very least your local representative could call to shame any other member of the ruling class that is not publicly and vocally condemning this horror.
  - missedthecue 6y ago
    Have sanctions ever worked? They haven't worked on Cuba. They haven't worked on Venezuela. They haven't worked on Russia. They haven't worked on North Korea. They haven't worked anywhere I can think of.
    - Tiktaalik 6y ago
      South Africa.
    - gherkinnn 6y ago
      Neither in Iraq. Nor in Iran.
    - runarberg 6y ago
      The countries you picked as an example is a little curious. Sanctions against Russia were really weak and limited, I don’t think anybody had any intentions for them to work at all. The sanctions of Cuba and Venezuela (or embargo in the case of Cuba) were targeted against their autonomy, i.e. countries were not OK with their economic policies so they imposed the sanctions (which were more devastating then any action by the government in Cuba). In the case of Venezuela the sanctions are targeted against a democratically elected government in favor of an opposition that was never elected. The goal here is to abolish democracy, what do you expect the Venezuelan government to do? This leaves North Korea, which is a genuine example of sanctions not working (and in fact casing harm in them self, since the victims are often starving citizens). However threats of further sanctions have worked in the past to prevent North Korea from developing a nuclear weapons program (which they later developed anyway). So I’ll give you that one. But now let’s turn to South Africa. The Apartheid government was supported by many rich nations throughout the late 20th century. Their crimes got worse and worse over the years. Until the international community finally came together in the last decade of the century and imposed heavy sanctions, even excluded them from participating in cultural and sporting events. The apartheid government finally collapsed and South Africa got their first democratically elected precedent that represented a majority of the nation in 1994. But I don’t think it is fair to talk only about the failure of sanctions to actively work in this context, the alternative here (as per ancestor comment) is military intervention. I could just as easily come up with a list of countries where military intervention did not resolve anything (or left the country seriously damage): • Cuba • Libya • Syria • Afghanistan • Yemen • Somalia You could make the case for Rwanda, East Timor, Cambodia, or even Nazi Germany. But those cases are more nuanced than that, and claiming that military intervention was a “response that worked” would be an inexcusable simplification of how the events unfolded.

rglover 6y ago

Educate others. Share this information. Talk about it and get it into the public conversation.

bhaskara2 6y ago

Stop buying China made goods and educate your family members to do so as well. This is good starting point

arwineap 6y ago
Is that even possible? What is made in the US that doesn't buy raw materials or partially assembled materials from china?
- ericd 6y ago
  Sounds like there might be demand for some certification that looks into the whole supply chain of a company, and can offer levels of “Made in the US” certification, bronze, silver, gold, platinum for 100% end to end. Similarly, it would be great for an estimate and certification of carbon emissions of the supply chain for each product.
  - gremlinsinc 6y ago
    Made in the USA is a bit...of a pipe dream. U.S. cost of living is higher, so prices for all products would skyrocket. However, there's MANY countries that are NOT China. We could instead certify products against supporting bad regimes, and using slave / prison labor in the supply chain.
    - ericd 6y ago
      For products where labor is a big input, yeah the delta is probably too high for most unless we get carbon taxes, tariffs, or some other factor that evens the field, but the US also supposedly has quite a bit of highly automated manufacturing. And the purpose is to allow people who place a premium on that to consider it. But yeah, it could also serve to give visibility into the breakdown of countries of origin, for those who just want to avoid sending money to countries they view as abusive.
- themacguffinman 6y ago
  I doubt you can fully eliminate China-sourced products but looking at "TAA compliant" products is a start. TAA compliance is a US federal standard that guarantees a minimum level of manufacturing involvement in TAA countries [1], which is a list that does not include China. I'm not going to pretend I'm able to avoid China in all my purchasing decisions but I now do some research to avoid China-made or at least China-designed products. [1] https://gsa.federalschedules.com/resources/taa-designated-countries/ https://gsa.federalschedules.com/resources/taa-designated-co...

lmeyerov 6y ago

Vote

agent00f 6y ago

You can start by reading at least the wiki articles about the subjects in question instead of just US agitprop, for example what led to the crackdown. The Uighurs are seriously lucky this wasn't Murica they ran afoul of. It really is hilarious how easy the ostensibly "educated" tech class is manipulate same as the fox news audience.

Gibbon1 6y ago
One thing I never see mentioned was the US and it's allies used Uighur's as mercenaries in Syria.