3 ms·

People seem to really want to correlate all kinds of things together with this virus when in reality we just don’t know. There are 1000s of variables- many of w

People seem to really want to correlate all kinds of things together with this virus when in reality we just don’t know. There are 1000s of variables- many of which we don’t even know of yet. One thing I’ve personally found interesting in the US is that nobody talks about the general poor health of a plurality of Americans. We lead the way in obesity and related diseases. Surely that is a factor in covid deaths but I haven’t seen anyone say it aloud.

lambdaba 6y ago
Americans probably have the worst health, or more precisely immune system fitness, in the world, as evidenced by the epidemic of chronic disease. My opinion is that, along with population density, is the only significant factor. The reason it's not discussed much is that society as a whole is still under the pharma paradigm, where individual agency on health is all but negated, and "health", is mostly dispensed by a doctor prescribing medicine. Hence the focus on things like masks and expensive drugs like Remdesivir (which is useless) VS getting proper vitamin D status, for example (which is crucial for immune system function and has been shown to be a major factor in COVID).
- literallycancer 6y ago
  Why do you think it's useless?
  - lambdaba 6y ago
    I read that in studies, including a meta-study showing no difference in mortality rate. I suppose it's not strictly "useless" as it apparently can reduce time spent in ICU in patients who would get better anyway, but in my view to call it useful it should affect outcomes. I'm also betraying my frustration with pharma's hold on the medical system and minds, where common sense interventions like correcting deficiencies in vitamin D, zinc etc. are seemingly ignored. Even the media is in on it. It's really an awful situation.
- akiselev 6y ago
  That "epidemic of chronic disease" isn't an American phenomenon, it's a global one. The percentage of people suffering from chronic conditions is surprisingly stable from country to country. It's the prevalence of acute diseases that changes due to quality of healthcare and (in the case of COVID) transient government competence. The each step in the shift from subsistence agriculture => industrial labor => sedentary lifestyles are characterized by their own maladies. It starts with chronic malnutrition, then moves to chronic diseases cause by pollution, then to chronic obesity and heart disease and is compounded by climate. Each country has its own unique mix of the four but the overall rates don't change much.
  - lambdaba 6y ago
    I agree, it's not American but it's an American invention and as such America has it more extreme: nowhere else do you see such extreme obesity, and so much processed food... I don't agree that America doesn't have the highest rate of lifestyle-induced disease, of that's what you were implying.
    - akiselev 6y ago
      You can't judge a chronic disease by whether or not it's a lifestyle choice. A chronic disease is a chronic disease and in most cases, it doesn't just go away - otherwise, it'd be called an acute disease. It's not even particularly right anyway. Most of the western world is a few years or a few decades behind the United States in obesity rates and not far behind at all on heart disease.
clairity 6y ago
talking about the poor general health of americans is brushed aside seemingly because it only stirs negative feelings like helplessness, even though improving nutrition and fitness would do much more to reduce illness, declined quality of life, and premature death than nearly any other health mitigation (even in relation to covid). it's the same as with the performative aspects of masks: worn in public to feel affirmed for positive action but having no meaningful impact, while doing nothing in private (due to psychosocial awkwardness and its negativity), where some distance can meaninfully reduce transmission rates but provides no positivity (esteem).

lambdaba 6y ago

Americans probably have the worst health, or more precisely immune system fitness, in the world, as evidenced by the epidemic of chronic disease. My opinion is that, along with population density, is the only significant factor. The reason it's not discussed much is that society as a whole is still under the pharma paradigm, where individual agency on health is all but negated, and "health", is mostly dispensed by a doctor prescribing medicine. Hence the focus on things like masks and expensive drugs like Remdesivir (which is useless) VS getting proper vitamin D status, for example (which is crucial for immune system function and has been shown to be a major factor in COVID).

literallycancer 6y ago
Why do you think it's useless?
- lambdaba 6y ago
  I read that in studies, including a meta-study showing no difference in mortality rate. I suppose it's not strictly "useless" as it apparently can reduce time spent in ICU in patients who would get better anyway, but in my view to call it useful it should affect outcomes. I'm also betraying my frustration with pharma's hold on the medical system and minds, where common sense interventions like correcting deficiencies in vitamin D, zinc etc. are seemingly ignored. Even the media is in on it. It's really an awful situation.
akiselev 6y ago
That "epidemic of chronic disease" isn't an American phenomenon, it's a global one. The percentage of people suffering from chronic conditions is surprisingly stable from country to country. It's the prevalence of acute diseases that changes due to quality of healthcare and (in the case of COVID) transient government competence. The each step in the shift from subsistence agriculture => industrial labor => sedentary lifestyles are characterized by their own maladies. It starts with chronic malnutrition, then moves to chronic diseases cause by pollution, then to chronic obesity and heart disease and is compounded by climate. Each country has its own unique mix of the four but the overall rates don't change much.
- lambdaba 6y ago
  I agree, it's not American but it's an American invention and as such America has it more extreme: nowhere else do you see such extreme obesity, and so much processed food... I don't agree that America doesn't have the highest rate of lifestyle-induced disease, of that's what you were implying.
  - akiselev 6y ago
    You can't judge a chronic disease by whether or not it's a lifestyle choice. A chronic disease is a chronic disease and in most cases, it doesn't just go away - otherwise, it'd be called an acute disease. It's not even particularly right anyway. Most of the western world is a few years or a few decades behind the United States in obesity rates and not far behind at all on heart disease.

clairity 6y ago

talking about the poor general health of americans is brushed aside seemingly because it only stirs negative feelings like helplessness, even though improving nutrition and fitness would do much more to reduce illness, declined quality of life, and premature death than nearly any other health mitigation (even in relation to covid). it's the same as with the performative aspects of masks: worn in public to feel affirmed for positive action but having no meaningful impact, while doing nothing in private (due to psychosocial awkwardness and its negativity), where some distance can meaninfully reduce transmission rates but provides no positivity (esteem).