5 ms·

Man, I never cared much for QAnon, but the way so many mainstream institutions are joining together, using the exact same misleading talking points, to censor s

by ufmace 6y ago

Man, I never cared much for QAnon, but the way so many mainstream institutions are joining together, using the exact same misleading talking points, to censor something off the internet makes me wonder if they're onto something after all.

logicchains 6y ago
It's amazing how skeptical people are of the idea of a paedophile ring among the elites when only recently Jeffrey Epstein was arrested for running one (and mysteriously died in custody).
- ibejoeb 6y ago
  This is what I don't understand about qanon, which I assume is because what I know of qanon is only this surface-level premise. Where does it go off the rails? Because--if we're being real with ourselves--we have to contend with the fact there is a pedophile island, and heads of state, royals, and other elite are credibly implicated the sex trafficking that sustains it.
  - ufmace 6y ago
    AIUI, the key part of QAnon is "the storm", the idea that some secretive group in the Trump administration is preparing some kind of mass indictments, possibly involving military tribunals, to bust all of the secret pedophiles. This is "the plan" that QAnon people implore us to "trust". No matter how bizarre and disconnected the happenings in various Government agencies seem, it's all supposedly part of "the plan" that we're supposed to just trust. Pedophile rings in the highest levels of Government and high society seem disturbingly plausible. I have no idea who's connected to it or how it all works, but I bet we'd all be pretty disturbed if it ever really came to light. But I'm not about to buy that there's a secret plan that's going to make it all work out, and everything is actually happening according to that plan.
    - hajile 6y ago
      I was doing some reading on Qanon. The weirdest part to me was how FEW correlations they have to offer. If I give a large group 4,000+ pieces of random information and a multi-year block of history, I'd expect the number of interesting and surprising coincidences to be staggering. Instead, the "deltas" and obsession with 17 is weak at best. One could say that it is more interesting that so many Q posts somehow have so very little in common with anything at all.
    - ibejoeb 6y ago
      >we'd all be pretty disturbed if it ever really came to light. It did, though. I would've expected more attention. Edit: so what, then? Did a massive sex trafficking ring that delivered underage girls to some of the world's most powerful people just get exposed? Did the head of it just die in a Manhattan jail. Was his partner just finally found after months on the lam? Or am I crazy?
      - ufmace 6y ago
        What's already out there is disturbing enough, but I don't think even 10% of what's really going on has come to light yet. Ex - how did Epstein die in jail? No way that's a legit suicide IMO. Some very powerful people must have arranged that. To expend so much energy on that, there must be a lot of powerful people who have a lot to lose if he were to ever talk. Who else might be out there involved in this? What sort of evidence is hidden away out there somewhere, waiting for somebody's dead man switch to flip? Exactly what is it that these people have been up to that they're so afraid of everybody finding out? I don't have any idea. Possibly it could be nothing, but I think there's way too many suspicious coincidences that look like somebody powerful pulling some strings for there to be nothing else there. Also, voting on Q related stuff gets really weird sometimes. No sense worrying about it.
    - throwawaygh 6y ago
      To be honest it sounds like a way to build a groundswell of populist support before arresting vast swaths of political prisoners. The same thing happened in Germany with Jews -- they were called enslavers and disease spreaders. So that people who didn't hate Jews could still get behind the violence because slavery and disease spreading are bad.
  - voldacar 6y ago
    Well the actual Q posts routinely give false predictions - I think I recall one where he said that hillary clinton would be arrested on date X, which obviously never happened. Also there was some kind of thing earlier this year about coronavirus being a hoax to scare the elites into saying indoors to make them easier for trump to arrest them (lol) But that said the general idea that powerful people can get away with pedophilia and probably all sorts of other crazy stuff should be undeniable by now given Epstein and his associates
  - arminiusreturns 6y ago
    I can explain. Its psyops techniques at play, one of the most blatant displays in a long time. There are a myriad, but the primary one at play is called "limited hangout". The example I usually use to illustrate this in conversation is flat earth conspiracy. Its so laughable, but what one will notice, with more analysis, is that many of the same people or sites that purport this genuinely ridiculous notion will also talk about things that are much more legitimate. The primary design is to discredit the genuine/legitimate " conspiracy theory" as crazy by association. In essence, qanon(the group and the boards that host believers), by giving a false outlet to those who would otherwise be digging into some very dangerous places, and then going on ridiculous tangents/assertions, essentially gets in front of the problem, so to speak. There are many more techniques at play with fun names regarding qanon, and it is highly likely there are gov and private intelligence agencies behind this. With an added benefit of being one of the best honeypots for conspiracy theorist metadata in the world. I could go on...
    - Minor49er 6y ago
      This is the premise behind entertainment outlets like Info Wars
- criddell 6y ago
  And Donald Trump has been the chief investigator going back a decade or two now? His recent trip to Walter Reed was just cover for his actual purpose which was a trip to hunt and kill some of these cannibalistic paedophiles? You aren't skeptical of that?
  - googthrowaway42 6y ago
    I don't believe any of that literally but Fred Trump (Donald Trump's father) was supposedly a member and financier of the John Birch Society: https://www.wikiwand.com/en/John_Birch_Society https://www.wikiwand.com/en/John_Birch_Society
- sarcastix 6y ago
  It's pervasive in the French political elite. They even wrote books praising the practice in the 1970s, before people started freaking out and they had to walk it back. A former minister of education (and a philosophy professor, so not some random quack) said in a TV interview that a senior French politician was arrested in Morocco while having sex with children, except of course he could not name the actual culprit for legal reasons. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/may/31/former-french-minister-child-abuse-claims https://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/may/31/former-french-...
voldacar 6y ago
Paying attention to the evolution of media and narrative over the past several years, it's as if every "mainstream institution" is fusing into one enormous superorganism mega-institution occupied by the same people, putting out the same stories and messages. It's sort of disturbing but also really fascinating.
theplague42 6y ago
What misleading talking points? How does the media mis-represent what QAnon is?
- ufmace 6y ago
  QAnon is consistently claimed to be "dangerous" and "violent". The only justification for this is the guy who went into Comet Ping Pong with a rifle in search of a supposed basement dungeon. But Comet Ping Pong is a Pizzagate thing, which is a different theory than QAnon. Pizzagate is based off of people taking deep dives into the leaked DNC emails and trying to follow up on some suspicious looking things. Just the kind of people who would be up for doing their own investigation into Comet Ping Pong. QAnon is based off of people obsessively following and examining every detail of the posts of the pseudonymous Q on 8chan/8kun. A key part of QAnon ideology is that everything is already happening according to "the plan", so there is nothing for individual followers to do. Some of the most anti-Q people I know believe that it's some kind of psy-op to convince people to do nothing in the face of massive corruption because everything is actually under control. Also worth remembering is that the CPP guy didn't actually hurt anyone. He scared the crap out of a few people, then was peacefully arrested. So linking QAnon to violence is extremely dubious at best. If anything, the opposite is more true. So why does everybody just push those talking points endlessly and nobody publishes anything skeptical of it? Why is it so incredibly dangerous that we must bust out all the stops against it? This very post is talking about trying to do a hostile purchase of the IP addresses their host uses - who ever heard of the need to do that?!? We don't even do that for ISIS, Al-Quada, etc. Meanwhile, Antifa and BLM are rioting and burning down cities across the nation, but nobody dares to even publish that, much less start to question their ideology and intentions. Perish the thought of even trying to investigate their links to the mainstream media, basically every major corporation, and Democrat party.

by ufmace 6y ago

logicchains 6y ago

It's amazing how skeptical people are of the idea of a paedophile ring among the elites when only recently Jeffrey Epstein was arrested for running one (and mysteriously died in custody).

ibejoeb 6y ago
This is what I don't understand about qanon, which I assume is because what I know of qanon is only this surface-level premise. Where does it go off the rails? Because--if we're being real with ourselves--we have to contend with the fact there is a pedophile island, and heads of state, royals, and other elite are credibly implicated the sex trafficking that sustains it.
- ufmace 6y ago
  AIUI, the key part of QAnon is "the storm", the idea that some secretive group in the Trump administration is preparing some kind of mass indictments, possibly involving military tribunals, to bust all of the secret pedophiles. This is "the plan" that QAnon people implore us to "trust". No matter how bizarre and disconnected the happenings in various Government agencies seem, it's all supposedly part of "the plan" that we're supposed to just trust. Pedophile rings in the highest levels of Government and high society seem disturbingly plausible. I have no idea who's connected to it or how it all works, but I bet we'd all be pretty disturbed if it ever really came to light. But I'm not about to buy that there's a secret plan that's going to make it all work out, and everything is actually happening according to that plan.
  - hajile 6y ago
    I was doing some reading on Qanon. The weirdest part to me was how FEW correlations they have to offer. If I give a large group 4,000+ pieces of random information and a multi-year block of history, I'd expect the number of interesting and surprising coincidences to be staggering. Instead, the "deltas" and obsession with 17 is weak at best. One could say that it is more interesting that so many Q posts somehow have so very little in common with anything at all.
  - ibejoeb 6y ago
    >we'd all be pretty disturbed if it ever really came to light. It did, though. I would've expected more attention. Edit: so what, then? Did a massive sex trafficking ring that delivered underage girls to some of the world's most powerful people just get exposed? Did the head of it just die in a Manhattan jail. Was his partner just finally found after months on the lam? Or am I crazy?
    - ufmace 6y ago
      What's already out there is disturbing enough, but I don't think even 10% of what's really going on has come to light yet. Ex - how did Epstein die in jail? No way that's a legit suicide IMO. Some very powerful people must have arranged that. To expend so much energy on that, there must be a lot of powerful people who have a lot to lose if he were to ever talk. Who else might be out there involved in this? What sort of evidence is hidden away out there somewhere, waiting for somebody's dead man switch to flip? Exactly what is it that these people have been up to that they're so afraid of everybody finding out? I don't have any idea. Possibly it could be nothing, but I think there's way too many suspicious coincidences that look like somebody powerful pulling some strings for there to be nothing else there. Also, voting on Q related stuff gets really weird sometimes. No sense worrying about it.
  - throwawaygh 6y ago
    To be honest it sounds like a way to build a groundswell of populist support before arresting vast swaths of political prisoners. The same thing happened in Germany with Jews -- they were called enslavers and disease spreaders. So that people who didn't hate Jews could still get behind the violence because slavery and disease spreading are bad.
- voldacar 6y ago
  Well the actual Q posts routinely give false predictions - I think I recall one where he said that hillary clinton would be arrested on date X, which obviously never happened. Also there was some kind of thing earlier this year about coronavirus being a hoax to scare the elites into saying indoors to make them easier for trump to arrest them (lol) But that said the general idea that powerful people can get away with pedophilia and probably all sorts of other crazy stuff should be undeniable by now given Epstein and his associates
- arminiusreturns 6y ago
  I can explain. Its psyops techniques at play, one of the most blatant displays in a long time. There are a myriad, but the primary one at play is called "limited hangout". The example I usually use to illustrate this in conversation is flat earth conspiracy. Its so laughable, but what one will notice, with more analysis, is that many of the same people or sites that purport this genuinely ridiculous notion will also talk about things that are much more legitimate. The primary design is to discredit the genuine/legitimate " conspiracy theory" as crazy by association. In essence, qanon(the group and the boards that host believers), by giving a false outlet to those who would otherwise be digging into some very dangerous places, and then going on ridiculous tangents/assertions, essentially gets in front of the problem, so to speak. There are many more techniques at play with fun names regarding qanon, and it is highly likely there are gov and private intelligence agencies behind this. With an added benefit of being one of the best honeypots for conspiracy theorist metadata in the world. I could go on...
  - Minor49er 6y ago
    This is the premise behind entertainment outlets like Info Wars
criddell 6y ago
And Donald Trump has been the chief investigator going back a decade or two now? His recent trip to Walter Reed was just cover for his actual purpose which was a trip to hunt and kill some of these cannibalistic paedophiles? You aren't skeptical of that?
- googthrowaway42 6y ago
  I don't believe any of that literally but Fred Trump (Donald Trump's father) was supposedly a member and financier of the John Birch Society: https://www.wikiwand.com/en/John_Birch_Society https://www.wikiwand.com/en/John_Birch_Society
sarcastix 6y ago
It's pervasive in the French political elite. They even wrote books praising the practice in the 1970s, before people started freaking out and they had to walk it back. A former minister of education (and a philosophy professor, so not some random quack) said in a TV interview that a senior French politician was arrested in Morocco while having sex with children, except of course he could not name the actual culprit for legal reasons. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/may/31/former-french-minister-child-abuse-claims https://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/may/31/former-french-...

voldacar 6y ago

Paying attention to the evolution of media and narrative over the past several years, it's as if every "mainstream institution" is fusing into one enormous superorganism mega-institution occupied by the same people, putting out the same stories and messages. It's sort of disturbing but also really fascinating.

theplague42 6y ago

What misleading talking points? How does the media mis-represent what QAnon is?

ufmace 6y ago
QAnon is consistently claimed to be "dangerous" and "violent". The only justification for this is the guy who went into Comet Ping Pong with a rifle in search of a supposed basement dungeon. But Comet Ping Pong is a Pizzagate thing, which is a different theory than QAnon. Pizzagate is based off of people taking deep dives into the leaked DNC emails and trying to follow up on some suspicious looking things. Just the kind of people who would be up for doing their own investigation into Comet Ping Pong. QAnon is based off of people obsessively following and examining every detail of the posts of the pseudonymous Q on 8chan/8kun. A key part of QAnon ideology is that everything is already happening according to "the plan", so there is nothing for individual followers to do. Some of the most anti-Q people I know believe that it's some kind of psy-op to convince people to do nothing in the face of massive corruption because everything is actually under control. Also worth remembering is that the CPP guy didn't actually hurt anyone. He scared the crap out of a few people, then was peacefully arrested. So linking QAnon to violence is extremely dubious at best. If anything, the opposite is more true. So why does everybody just push those talking points endlessly and nobody publishes anything skeptical of it? Why is it so incredibly dangerous that we must bust out all the stops against it? This very post is talking about trying to do a hostile purchase of the IP addresses their host uses - who ever heard of the need to do that?!? We don't even do that for ISIS, Al-Quada, etc. Meanwhile, Antifa and BLM are rioting and burning down cities across the nation, but nobody dares to even publish that, much less start to question their ideology and intentions. Perish the thought of even trying to investigate their links to the mainstream media, basically every major corporation, and Democrat party.