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> No healthcare, education or unemployment benefits India has a massive welfare state. Just because it doesn't benefit iPhone 12 buyers doesn't mean it doesn't

> No healthcare, education or unemployment benefits India has a massive welfare state. Just because it doesn't benefit iPhone 12 buyers doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Is the welfare state 100% effective? No. But it's disingenuous to say welfare doesn't play a role for millions of families.

hangonhn 6y ago
I wonder if the GP is complaining about the delivery of said welfare because at least on paper that welfare should be happening. Yet GP believes there are nearly zero benefits. Therefore, I wonder if there is a "disconnect" between what is suppose to happen and what actually happens on the ground.
- wobbly_bush 6y ago
  This is exactly it. On paper the government schemes are all well thought out and cover a large percentage of problems. The issue isn't in coming up with schemes, it's the implementation which is extremely lacking. So most of the money that is supposed to go into these schemes, end up being illegally pocketed by those in power. This is in addition to "paying a bribe" which most anecdotes talk about. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_in_India https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_in_India
- vshade 6y ago
  India is country with lots of poor people, so sometimes that money is not enough to have decent services for upper middle class citizens not feel like paying a lot for poor services. It is one of the problems of my home country, corruption is problem as well, but sometimes you're just paying lots of money because lots of people are paying nothing or very little.
  - wobbly_bush 6y ago
    It's a myth that the lack of government services are solely due to lack of funding or budget deficit. One of the original complaints in the thread was about government-provided healthcare and education. Government schools & hospitals exist, but they aren't exactly known for their quality apart from a few niche ones like IITs, IIMs, AIIMs. So is the issue that lack of funding is preventing these public services from being effective? We could look at any independent report to find the problems. A search on this issue brings up https://yourstory.com/2017/09/india-public-education-system?utm_pageloadtype=scroll https://yourstory.com/2017/09/india-public-education-system?..., it's not thorough report but it's a start. This brings to light another problem - unlike the developed countries, in India the average citizen doesn't even know the specifics of things that can be improved because there are hardly any independent organizations which raise awareness about specific policies, or which publish easy to digest reports for the general public to become better informed.
    - vshade 6y ago
      This doesn't contradicts that lack of funding is a problem, at least in the country from where I come public school teachers are usually underpaid and it can be hard to attract and keep the good ones without it.
      - throwawy42434 6y ago
        It isn't - public schooling was in a far better shape/quality 40-50 years back, when the Indian Boomers were growing up. This was a time of war and food-shortages; funding clearly is not the problem.
    - naruvimama 6y ago
      Previous generations of populist governments could be blamed for their short term thinking and political appointments to the dismal state of the Education system. It is a sector that really needs an upgrade and much of it requires very little money but the attitude of teachers and curriculum.
Jayakumark 6y ago
Just curious , What welfare are you referring to ?

hangonhn 6y ago

I wonder if the GP is complaining about the delivery of said welfare because at least on paper that welfare should be happening. Yet GP believes there are nearly zero benefits. Therefore, I wonder if there is a "disconnect" between what is suppose to happen and what actually happens on the ground.

wobbly_bush 6y ago
This is exactly it. On paper the government schemes are all well thought out and cover a large percentage of problems. The issue isn't in coming up with schemes, it's the implementation which is extremely lacking. So most of the money that is supposed to go into these schemes, end up being illegally pocketed by those in power. This is in addition to "paying a bribe" which most anecdotes talk about. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_in_India https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_in_India
vshade 6y ago
India is country with lots of poor people, so sometimes that money is not enough to have decent services for upper middle class citizens not feel like paying a lot for poor services. It is one of the problems of my home country, corruption is problem as well, but sometimes you're just paying lots of money because lots of people are paying nothing or very little.
- wobbly_bush 6y ago
  It's a myth that the lack of government services are solely due to lack of funding or budget deficit. One of the original complaints in the thread was about government-provided healthcare and education. Government schools & hospitals exist, but they aren't exactly known for their quality apart from a few niche ones like IITs, IIMs, AIIMs. So is the issue that lack of funding is preventing these public services from being effective? We could look at any independent report to find the problems. A search on this issue brings up https://yourstory.com/2017/09/india-public-education-system?utm_pageloadtype=scroll https://yourstory.com/2017/09/india-public-education-system?..., it's not thorough report but it's a start. This brings to light another problem - unlike the developed countries, in India the average citizen doesn't even know the specifics of things that can be improved because there are hardly any independent organizations which raise awareness about specific policies, or which publish easy to digest reports for the general public to become better informed.
  - vshade 6y ago
    This doesn't contradicts that lack of funding is a problem, at least in the country from where I come public school teachers are usually underpaid and it can be hard to attract and keep the good ones without it.
    - throwawy42434 6y ago
      It isn't - public schooling was in a far better shape/quality 40-50 years back, when the Indian Boomers were growing up. This was a time of war and food-shortages; funding clearly is not the problem.
  - naruvimama 6y ago
    Previous generations of populist governments could be blamed for their short term thinking and political appointments to the dismal state of the Education system. It is a sector that really needs an upgrade and much of it requires very little money but the attitude of teachers and curriculum.

Jayakumark 6y ago

Just curious , What welfare are you referring to ?