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My perception, from outside the US, is that the Republican party, in particular, works to actively subvert the voting process to exclude groups that are unlikel

by czzr 6y ago

My perception, from outside the US, is that the Republican party, in particular, works to actively subvert the voting process to exclude groups that are unlikely to vote for them (disproportionately poor minorities). But this view is of course based on what I read and hear. I’m curious what this looks like inside from the US - is my perception just not true? If it is true, why isn’t it seen as a huge scandal?

colanderman 6y ago
Your perception is spot on. It is seen as a huge scandal, just not by the party it benefits, which controls about 5/6 of national government (partially thanks to said policies), so nothing changes. EDIT: As others have noted, of course, perception depends on media bubbles, and reality may differ by place and time. Read my statement to be the perception of liberal mid-30s white male from the northeast coast, looking at the past ~15 years or so.
chewz 6y ago
Being also from outside US I have the opposite impression - that Democracts are actively manipulating comming elections. Of course this is from my random reading - I do not follow politics much. Must be living in a different media bubble. :)
- zzleeper 6y ago
  What the hell are you talking about? "actively manipulating"? Really, what media bubble is that?
dakna 6y ago
My personal opinion: There is no inside-the-US view on that, it changes based on the filter bubble you and your peers live in. The party in power is still in power and did a pretty good job making it harder to find out what is an actual fact and what is an alternative fact, so it takes more time and willingness to verify any claim. Instead it comes down to perception, beliefs and tribe behavior.
- soco 6y ago
  The mere fact that a party strategy is based on "alternative facts" disqualifies it in my eyes. Even if they might be right on everything else, one just shouldn't use made-up lies to win arguments, or votes.
happytoexplain 6y ago
While it's hard to be confident that one's information is not misleading for any political topic in the US, yes, your perception does appear to be the case. It is seen as a huge scandal by the minority of people who both consume news and are not on the same side of the political aisle that the story casts a shadow on, but that's how everything works on both sides (not to say both sides commit equivalent sins).
sparrish 6y ago
From the article: California alone accounts for almost half of national polling location cuts. Yeah, it's all those Republicans controlling California who are suppressing the vote... You're being misled.
- tzs 6y ago
  What you are overlooking is that California is going heavily for mail-in voting this year, with all registered voters automatically being sent a mail-in ballot. That's quite different from states that are cutting polling places without expanding mail-in voting.
AftHurrahWinch 6y ago
Per this Pew study, Democrats are twice as likely as conservative Republicans to believe that "everything possible should be done to make it easy for every citizen to vote", while the majority of conservative Republicans believe that "citizens should have to prove they want to vote" by taking steps to ensure they have the opportunity to vote. https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/10/31/conservative-republicans-are-least-supportive-of-making-it-easy-for-everyone-to-vote/ https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/10/31/conservativ... The founders of the United States also disagreed on this. If I remember correctly, some of them openly worried about the impact of letting poorly educated people vote, whereas Benjamin Franklin argued that the poorly informed vote essentially randomly, and so cancel each other out.
- diggernet 6y ago
  Interesting. I wonder how Franklin's views would change in a world of social media driven mass emotional manipulation.
  - basch 6y ago
    >I wonder how Franklin's views would change in a world of social media driven mass emotional manipulation. Not entirely different than the era of newspapers and the town crier. The volume might be more now, but the end result is roughly the same. A couple loud sources blanketing the majority of public opinion. Also, for his view not to stand up, wouldnt one group or the other need to be more represented on emotionally manipulative platforms?
    - diggernet 6y ago
      Not so much one group, but rather I was thinking of the directionality of emotional arguments. "Think of the children!" and all that. In a competition between a powerful emotional argument and logical counters to it (uninformed vs informed), the uninformed will not be voting randomly.
      - basch 6y ago
DrScump 6y ago
This is exactly the impression the author wants to make upon the reader. But it fails to point out the relevant numbers: 1) most deleted polling places are in blue states, not red States. 2) what is most important for access is not the raw number of polling places but the total time polling places are open and usable. Traditionally, this was just 12 or so hours on election day only. Now, many are open for multiple days... or weeks.

by czzr 6y ago

colanderman 6y ago

Your perception is spot on. It is seen as a huge scandal, just not by the party it benefits, which controls about 5/6 of national government (partially thanks to said policies), so nothing changes. EDIT: As others have noted, of course, perception depends on media bubbles, and reality may differ by place and time. Read my statement to be the perception of liberal mid-30s white male from the northeast coast, looking at the past ~15 years or so.

chewz 6y ago

Being also from outside US I have the opposite impression - that Democracts are actively manipulating comming elections. Of course this is from my random reading - I do not follow politics much. Must be living in a different media bubble. :)

zzleeper 6y ago
What the hell are you talking about? "actively manipulating"? Really, what media bubble is that?

dakna 6y ago

My personal opinion: There is no inside-the-US view on that, it changes based on the filter bubble you and your peers live in. The party in power is still in power and did a pretty good job making it harder to find out what is an actual fact and what is an alternative fact, so it takes more time and willingness to verify any claim. Instead it comes down to perception, beliefs and tribe behavior.

soco 6y ago
The mere fact that a party strategy is based on "alternative facts" disqualifies it in my eyes. Even if they might be right on everything else, one just shouldn't use made-up lies to win arguments, or votes.

happytoexplain 6y ago

While it's hard to be confident that one's information is not misleading for any political topic in the US, yes, your perception does appear to be the case. It is seen as a huge scandal by the minority of people who both consume news and are not on the same side of the political aisle that the story casts a shadow on, but that's how everything works on both sides (not to say both sides commit equivalent sins).

sparrish 6y ago

From the article: California alone accounts for almost half of national polling location cuts. Yeah, it's all those Republicans controlling California who are suppressing the vote... You're being misled.

tzs 6y ago
What you are overlooking is that California is going heavily for mail-in voting this year, with all registered voters automatically being sent a mail-in ballot. That's quite different from states that are cutting polling places without expanding mail-in voting.

AftHurrahWinch 6y ago

Per this Pew study, Democrats are twice as likely as conservative Republicans to believe that "everything possible should be done to make it easy for every citizen to vote", while the majority of conservative Republicans believe that "citizens should have to prove they want to vote" by taking steps to ensure they have the opportunity to vote. https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/10/31/conservative-republicans-are-least-supportive-of-making-it-easy-for-everyone-to-vote/ https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/10/31/conservativ... The founders of the United States also disagreed on this. If I remember correctly, some of them openly worried about the impact of letting poorly educated people vote, whereas Benjamin Franklin argued that the poorly informed vote essentially randomly, and so cancel each other out.

diggernet 6y ago
Interesting. I wonder how Franklin's views would change in a world of social media driven mass emotional manipulation.
- basch 6y ago
  >I wonder how Franklin's views would change in a world of social media driven mass emotional manipulation. Not entirely different than the era of newspapers and the town crier. The volume might be more now, but the end result is roughly the same. A couple loud sources blanketing the majority of public opinion. Also, for his view not to stand up, wouldnt one group or the other need to be more represented on emotionally manipulative platforms?
  - diggernet 6y ago
    Not so much one group, but rather I was thinking of the directionality of emotional arguments. "Think of the children!" and all that. In a competition between a powerful emotional argument and logical counters to it (uninformed vs informed), the uninformed will not be voting randomly.
    - basch 6y ago

DrScump 6y ago

This is exactly the impression the author wants to make upon the reader. But it fails to point out the relevant numbers: 1) most deleted polling places are in blue states, not red States. 2) what is most important for access is not the raw number of polling places but the total time polling places are open and usable. Traditionally, this was just 12 or so hours on election day only. Now, many are open for multiple days... or weeks.