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The word “ketosis” gets thrown around a lot. It’s a physiological state that’s objectively quite hard to enter. I would ask, are you quantifying if you are “in

The word “ketosis” gets thrown around a lot. It’s a physiological state that’s objectively quite hard to enter. I would ask, are you quantifying if you are “in ketosis” or not at any point during your fast, and if so how? Or is this just a gut feeling?

fluffything 6y ago
> and if so how? I use ketosis strips (Ketostix). You pee on them, and they tell you. Totally worth the 5$ they cost. I'm happy in full ketosis, or no ketosis at all, but the "half-way" ketosis state is just pure torture. The strips let me know how good I'm doing, so if things deviate a bit, e.g. because one day I ate ""too many carbs"", I notice quickly, and auto-correct.
- TimSchumann 6y ago
  Been my experience that these vary widely depending on hydration levels. Also I’ve heard/read, and I’m not sure how accurate this is, you can think of ketones in urine as ‘overflow’ and thus aren’t always an accurate portrayal of how much your body is producing. On top of that, your body gets more efficient at using ketones as an energy source over time so your urine ‘overflow’ can spike at various points just because your body consumes less ketones for it’s energy needs. All of that is latent knowledge from random reading over the last 4 or so years, so grain of salt and all that.
  - 1_over_n 6y ago
    This ^
  - fluffything 6y ago
    How easy is the blood testing?
TimSchumann 6y ago
Literally testing my blood, with a medical device.
- beagle3 6y ago
  Can you recommend one from your experience? I'm in the market for one. (Preferably one that doesn't need prescription)
  - TimSchumann 6y ago
    Abbot Precision Xtra is the most accurate, unfortunately the strips are expensive to the tune of 3 to 4 USD per strip if you get them new. NovaMax is also decent, though I’ve found it to be not quite as consistent or accurate.
    - beagle3 6y ago
      Thanks!
ravenstine 6y ago
> It’s a physiological state that’s objectively quite hard to enter. No, it isn't. The human body developed to bounce in and out of ketosis all the time. It's only hard to enter if you are always in a fed state and rarely in a fasted state. When you're fasting, it's not particularly hard to get back into ketosis in the same day, although it can take 24 to 48 hours for someone who isn't getting even light exercise. That's still way, way faster than the weeks it can take to get into ketosis on keto. (unless maybe you want to eat mostly protein and little fat, which is miserable) I speak from extensive experience. A few weeks ago, after a 72 hour fast, I chowed on a pile of salmon sushi, measured my ketones throughout the day with ketone test strips, and was back in dark purple by the end of the night. Though normally it takes until the next morning for ketones to start showing up in my urine again, I believe it happened much faster because I was walking a lot that day. That was impossible to do back when I was just eating strict keto macros. Anyone who doesn't believe me should try themselves by doing a few 72 hour fasts and refeeding on high protein, moderate carbs. They'd be surprised that it doesn't take an unreasonable amount of time to get back into ketosis. It's a perspective changer because it shows that occasionally eating carbs socially isn't the end of the world, because you'll be back in fat burning mode within a day or so.
- 1_over_n 6y ago
  So you can objectively track when your “bouncing” in and out of ketosis, like say for instance the way your heart beat changes ? urine test strips only measure acetoacetate. Urinary ketones often correlate poorly with serum levels because of variability in excretion of ketones by the kidney, influence of hydration status, and renal function. (Wikipedia - I’m being a bit lazy). I’m not arguing against fasting, or low carb diets. I’m making the point that ketosis isn’t as easy to “bounce” into as people think (though it doesn’t mean there are not benefits from fasting or low carb diets).
  - beagle3 6y ago
    I suspect what the keto community calls "fat adapted" is basically that "easily bouncing in and out" state -- which some people reach easily, and some take weeks or months to achieve on keto. (but as far as I know, takes at most 3 days to achieve while fasting)

fluffything 6y ago

> and if so how? I use ketosis strips (Ketostix). You pee on them, and they tell you. Totally worth the 5$ they cost. I'm happy in full ketosis, or no ketosis at all, but the "half-way" ketosis state is just pure torture. The strips let me know how good I'm doing, so if things deviate a bit, e.g. because one day I ate ""too many carbs"", I notice quickly, and auto-correct.

TimSchumann 6y ago
Been my experience that these vary widely depending on hydration levels. Also I’ve heard/read, and I’m not sure how accurate this is, you can think of ketones in urine as ‘overflow’ and thus aren’t always an accurate portrayal of how much your body is producing. On top of that, your body gets more efficient at using ketones as an energy source over time so your urine ‘overflow’ can spike at various points just because your body consumes less ketones for it’s energy needs. All of that is latent knowledge from random reading over the last 4 or so years, so grain of salt and all that.
- 1_over_n 6y ago
  This ^
- fluffything 6y ago
  How easy is the blood testing?

TimSchumann 6y ago

Literally testing my blood, with a medical device.

beagle3 6y ago
Can you recommend one from your experience? I'm in the market for one. (Preferably one that doesn't need prescription)
- TimSchumann 6y ago
  Abbot Precision Xtra is the most accurate, unfortunately the strips are expensive to the tune of 3 to 4 USD per strip if you get them new. NovaMax is also decent, though I’ve found it to be not quite as consistent or accurate.
  - beagle3 6y ago
    Thanks!

ravenstine 6y ago

> It’s a physiological state that’s objectively quite hard to enter. No, it isn't. The human body developed to bounce in and out of ketosis all the time. It's only hard to enter if you are always in a fed state and rarely in a fasted state. When you're fasting, it's not particularly hard to get back into ketosis in the same day, although it can take 24 to 48 hours for someone who isn't getting even light exercise. That's still way, way faster than the weeks it can take to get into ketosis on keto. (unless maybe you want to eat mostly protein and little fat, which is miserable) I speak from extensive experience. A few weeks ago, after a 72 hour fast, I chowed on a pile of salmon sushi, measured my ketones throughout the day with ketone test strips, and was back in dark purple by the end of the night. Though normally it takes until the next morning for ketones to start showing up in my urine again, I believe it happened much faster because I was walking a lot that day. That was impossible to do back when I was just eating strict keto macros. Anyone who doesn't believe me should try themselves by doing a few 72 hour fasts and refeeding on high protein, moderate carbs. They'd be surprised that it doesn't take an unreasonable amount of time to get back into ketosis. It's a perspective changer because it shows that occasionally eating carbs socially isn't the end of the world, because you'll be back in fat burning mode within a day or so.

1_over_n 6y ago
So you can objectively track when your “bouncing” in and out of ketosis, like say for instance the way your heart beat changes ? urine test strips only measure acetoacetate. Urinary ketones often correlate poorly with serum levels because of variability in excretion of ketones by the kidney, influence of hydration status, and renal function. (Wikipedia - I’m being a bit lazy). I’m not arguing against fasting, or low carb diets. I’m making the point that ketosis isn’t as easy to “bounce” into as people think (though it doesn’t mean there are not benefits from fasting or low carb diets).
- beagle3 6y ago
  I suspect what the keto community calls "fat adapted" is basically that "easily bouncing in and out" state -- which some people reach easily, and some take weeks or months to achieve on keto. (but as far as I know, takes at most 3 days to achieve while fasting)