3 ms·

It's just a negotiation tactic. Most HR people are playing a game that most applicants aren't prepared for and/or interested in. The offer, the dancing aroun

by roc 16y ago

It's just a negotiation tactic. Most HR people are playing a game that most applicants aren't prepared for and/or interested in. The offer, the dancing around, even the bit about looking for "top people". It's all just trying to dress up the game to their advantage [1]. [1] Your ability to negotiate effectively is helped/hampered by your knowledge of their field of candidates. Ergo, they inevitably say 'top people', to skew your perception of your competitors to their advantage.

rhizome 16y ago
Most HR people are playing a game that most applicants aren't prepared for and/or interested in. Sure, but that's what makes them scum. It's bad-faith negotiating.
- fleitz 16y ago
  How is it bad faith? They are called HR, Human Resources, to any company who employs such a department you are indistinguishable from coal. The goal is to get the coal at the lowest price, if you have to buy it sodas and tell it what a wonderful employee it is to get it to accept low salaries then so be it. What usually wakes HR up is a detailed spreadsheet of the value you add to the business and that you will be going elsewhere unless you are properly compensated, as well as when they bring other people into it saying "Ok, lets get them in here and get their salary up too" or "fire them if you need extra money, your lack of money to pay me is not my problem, this is a business, I am not your bank, if you need a loan call them." Grow a pair and walk out on the spot, if you can't then save so next time you can. Thats how you negotiate by putting the business in a position where it is fucked if they don't do what you want, just like a business plays its min wage employees. Letting people put themselves into stupid positions is a two way street.
  - rhizome 16y ago
    Human Resources, to any company who employs such a department you are indistinguishable from coal. It's bad faith to contend that a programmer is nothing more than an inert substance. I'm not talking about emotions or morale or anything woo-woo like that, just that programmers do more than coal. You can't burn a person and get code as a result. HR workers who follow your logic do a disservice to themselves and the company, because when a programmer is performing under expectations, HR is not going to say, "well, they're a piece of coal, what do you expect?" No, programmers are only coal at the beginning, and then the script flips after they're hired. That's textbook bad faith, and "walking out on the spot" always involves having wasted time at least going through the interview process. Charming.
    - deleted 16y ago
      [deleted]
      - rhizome 16y ago
        The function of HR in a business is to keep employee costs down. I imagine that a lot of HR do think this, but I think it's an oversimplification of their duty that compromises the interests of the company. I wouldn't go so far as to say that HR's overall mission is fiduciary.
  - gaius 16y ago
    They are called HR, Human Resources, to any company who employs such a department you are indistinguishable from coal Not disputing that but seriously: what sort of people call other people "resources"? Did they think that's who they were going to grow up to be, when they were kids? They even know it's wrong because they don't call themselves "spreadsheet resources", they're "HR professionals".

by roc 16y ago

rhizome 16y ago

Most HR people are playing a game that most applicants aren't prepared for and/or interested in. Sure, but that's what makes them scum. It's bad-faith negotiating.

fleitz 16y ago
How is it bad faith? They are called HR, Human Resources, to any company who employs such a department you are indistinguishable from coal. The goal is to get the coal at the lowest price, if you have to buy it sodas and tell it what a wonderful employee it is to get it to accept low salaries then so be it. What usually wakes HR up is a detailed spreadsheet of the value you add to the business and that you will be going elsewhere unless you are properly compensated, as well as when they bring other people into it saying "Ok, lets get them in here and get their salary up too" or "fire them if you need extra money, your lack of money to pay me is not my problem, this is a business, I am not your bank, if you need a loan call them." Grow a pair and walk out on the spot, if you can't then save so next time you can. Thats how you negotiate by putting the business in a position where it is fucked if they don't do what you want, just like a business plays its min wage employees. Letting people put themselves into stupid positions is a two way street.
- rhizome 16y ago
  Human Resources, to any company who employs such a department you are indistinguishable from coal. It's bad faith to contend that a programmer is nothing more than an inert substance. I'm not talking about emotions or morale or anything woo-woo like that, just that programmers do more than coal. You can't burn a person and get code as a result. HR workers who follow your logic do a disservice to themselves and the company, because when a programmer is performing under expectations, HR is not going to say, "well, they're a piece of coal, what do you expect?" No, programmers are only coal at the beginning, and then the script flips after they're hired. That's textbook bad faith, and "walking out on the spot" always involves having wasted time at least going through the interview process. Charming.
  - deleted 16y ago
    [deleted]
    - rhizome 16y ago
      The function of HR in a business is to keep employee costs down. I imagine that a lot of HR do think this, but I think it's an oversimplification of their duty that compromises the interests of the company. I wouldn't go so far as to say that HR's overall mission is fiduciary.
- gaius 16y ago
  They are called HR, Human Resources, to any company who employs such a department you are indistinguishable from coal Not disputing that but seriously: what sort of people call other people "resources"? Did they think that's who they were going to grow up to be, when they were kids? They even know it's wrong because they don't call themselves "spreadsheet resources", they're "HR professionals".