6 ms·

The wiki is a great reference, but a search of the word "grooming" across Bing [¹], Google [²] and DuckDuckGo [³] all lead to references to child pedophilia. T

The wiki is a great reference, but a search of the word "grooming" across Bing [¹], Google [²] and DuckDuckGo [³] all lead to references to child pedophilia. The definition of that word is changing and not accepting that fact looks dated. Might just be my opinion, feel free to comment if you disagree. [1] https://www.bing.com/search?q=grooming https://www.bing.com/search?q=grooming [2] https://duckduckgo.com/?q=grooming https://duckduckgo.com/?q=grooming [3] https://www.google.com/search?q=grooming https://www.google.com/search?q=grooming

JohnBooty 6y ago
This is nothing new. Dozens and dozens of terms in our industry have "other" meanings. For example it is common to talk about "pegging" a server -- a reference to how physical speedometers and other such gauges used to work. "Pegging" has a more recent sexual meaning as well. And then of course there is "penetration" testing in the security sphere. And so on and so on. It's fine. There is no conflict.
- sneak 6y ago
  My favorite: cryptography frequently uses a nonce.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - JohnBooty 6y ago
    Ah. I was never even aware of the slang definition here: "prison slang a rapist or child molester; a sexual offender" Thank you for the knowledge! https://www.thefreedictionary.com/nonce https://www.thefreedictionary.com/nonce (I see that it is primarily a UK term)
- bregma 6y ago
  Now I want to get a job in the server room. Boot strapping the master sounds like fun suddenly.
- akdor1154 6y ago
  Huh, I thought 'pegging' a server came directly from the sexual meaning. TIL.
  - JohnBooty 6y ago
    Etymology is never really an exact science, but here's a pretty good discussion: https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/202318/etymology-of-a-pegged-cpu https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/202318/etymology... Anecdotally... I remember hearing and reading "pegged" in an IT context back in the 1990s, at least 10-15 years before the sex term seemed to gain widespread usage. It was definitely used in entirely work-safe contexts where one would never dream of making anal sex references. Of course, now that you mention it, I think your belief is likely common enough to make me reconsider its use! I think a lot of folks hearing "pegging" in 2020 probably think of the sex practice before they think of speedometers -- a lot of people don't have cars, and many that do never notice the little pegs. However, I do think "pegging" (a somewhat obscure IT jargon term, with obscure etymology) is in a different situation than "grooming," an incredibly common everyday word. Retiring a bit of jargon is entirely different than retiring a an everyday word.
amriksohata 6y ago
Its a sensitive topic here in the UK recently with the Pakistani grooming gang issue, however the I noticed American agile talks also use the term grooming for refinement
- qz2 6y ago
  UK here. It’s really not sensitive. 99% of us are quite happy with words having different meanings based on context. The other 1% seem to worry about this and welcome an age of newspeak and book burnings. I know who I’m afraid of.
  - johnisgood 6y ago
    And the problem is that we do cater to the 1%. See GitHub trying to replace master branch to main branch, or Python replacing the master-slave terminology, and so forth. This is just two examples, there are billions. There is a guy (or a bot) who has opened over 3k issues to projects about the master-slave terminology change[1]. GitHub is doing nothing against it, and yes, they know about it. You could replace GitHub with loads of other major companies and whatnot, they are not only allowing it, but encourage it, they are speaking up with the 1% and you can clearly see the effects. [1] https://github.com/bopopescu https://github.com/bopopescu (check out his "contribution" activity: "Joined GitHub", and then "Opened 3,226 other pull requests in 3,208 repositories")
    - qz2 6y ago
      Yes github actually fucked me up with the whole master/main thing the other day. I was trying to push a local repo I had been working on for a few days to a new github repo. Cost me an hour of head scratching until I realised what the deal was. I've defaulted all my repos back to "master" in line with git CLI which is the single source of truth. Github is on my personal shitlist for a number of reasons though and this is nowhere near #1.
bigyikes 6y ago
Nobody tell them about dog groomers...
Quarrelsome 6y ago
> The definition of that word is changing No, it just has multiple definitions, like many words do.
dinkleberg 6y ago
Just because others are using a word for a different meaning doesn’t mean you should abandon its original meaning and just give up on it. Grooming is not an irregular word. The act of grooming oneself is hopefully a regular activity. Brushing your teeth, trimming your nails, getting hair cuts, etc. The word is also regularly used with pets. IMO this is like when a while back all the news sites were talking about how the OK hand sign was a white supremacist symbol. If everyone had stopped using it, then perhaps it would still be seen as a symbol for that. But everyone that that was dumb and kept using it the way it always has always has been and that new association was lost.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
DonHopkins 6y ago
The number two also means poop. Should we stop using number two?

JohnBooty 6y ago

This is nothing new. Dozens and dozens of terms in our industry have "other" meanings. For example it is common to talk about "pegging" a server -- a reference to how physical speedometers and other such gauges used to work. "Pegging" has a more recent sexual meaning as well. And then of course there is "penetration" testing in the security sphere. And so on and so on. It's fine. There is no conflict.

sneak 6y ago
My favorite: cryptography frequently uses a nonce.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- JohnBooty 6y ago
  Ah. I was never even aware of the slang definition here: "prison slang a rapist or child molester; a sexual offender" Thank you for the knowledge! https://www.thefreedictionary.com/nonce https://www.thefreedictionary.com/nonce (I see that it is primarily a UK term)
bregma 6y ago
Now I want to get a job in the server room. Boot strapping the master sounds like fun suddenly.
akdor1154 6y ago
Huh, I thought 'pegging' a server came directly from the sexual meaning. TIL.
- JohnBooty 6y ago
  Etymology is never really an exact science, but here's a pretty good discussion: https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/202318/etymology-of-a-pegged-cpu https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/202318/etymology... Anecdotally... I remember hearing and reading "pegged" in an IT context back in the 1990s, at least 10-15 years before the sex term seemed to gain widespread usage. It was definitely used in entirely work-safe contexts where one would never dream of making anal sex references. Of course, now that you mention it, I think your belief is likely common enough to make me reconsider its use! I think a lot of folks hearing "pegging" in 2020 probably think of the sex practice before they think of speedometers -- a lot of people don't have cars, and many that do never notice the little pegs. However, I do think "pegging" (a somewhat obscure IT jargon term, with obscure etymology) is in a different situation than "grooming," an incredibly common everyday word. Retiring a bit of jargon is entirely different than retiring a an everyday word.

amriksohata 6y ago

Its a sensitive topic here in the UK recently with the Pakistani grooming gang issue, however the I noticed American agile talks also use the term grooming for refinement

qz2 6y ago
UK here. It’s really not sensitive. 99% of us are quite happy with words having different meanings based on context. The other 1% seem to worry about this and welcome an age of newspeak and book burnings. I know who I’m afraid of.
- johnisgood 6y ago
  And the problem is that we do cater to the 1%. See GitHub trying to replace master branch to main branch, or Python replacing the master-slave terminology, and so forth. This is just two examples, there are billions. There is a guy (or a bot) who has opened over 3k issues to projects about the master-slave terminology change[1]. GitHub is doing nothing against it, and yes, they know about it. You could replace GitHub with loads of other major companies and whatnot, they are not only allowing it, but encourage it, they are speaking up with the 1% and you can clearly see the effects. [1] https://github.com/bopopescu https://github.com/bopopescu (check out his "contribution" activity: "Joined GitHub", and then "Opened 3,226 other pull requests in 3,208 repositories")
  - qz2 6y ago
    Yes github actually fucked me up with the whole master/main thing the other day. I was trying to push a local repo I had been working on for a few days to a new github repo. Cost me an hour of head scratching until I realised what the deal was. I've defaulted all my repos back to "master" in line with git CLI which is the single source of truth. Github is on my personal shitlist for a number of reasons though and this is nowhere near #1.

bigyikes 6y ago

Nobody tell them about dog groomers...

Quarrelsome 6y ago

> The definition of that word is changing No, it just has multiple definitions, like many words do.

dinkleberg 6y ago

Just because others are using a word for a different meaning doesn’t mean you should abandon its original meaning and just give up on it. Grooming is not an irregular word. The act of grooming oneself is hopefully a regular activity. Brushing your teeth, trimming your nails, getting hair cuts, etc. The word is also regularly used with pets. IMO this is like when a while back all the news sites were talking about how the OK hand sign was a white supremacist symbol. If everyone had stopped using it, then perhaps it would still be seen as a symbol for that. But everyone that that was dumb and kept using it the way it always has always has been and that new association was lost.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

DonHopkins 6y ago

The number two also means poop. Should we stop using number two?