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Steve Jobs Responds to iOS Location-Tracking Controversy

17 points by domino 16y ago

Cherian_Abraham 16y ago
Correct me if I am wrong. Jobs is technically correct. Apple does not track anyone's location. Your iphone does. And in their infinite wisdom, Apple decided to store these footprints in the phone, rather unsecurely. Stupid? Yes. And a one line response from Steve does not maketh the problem go away. This adds more fuel to the fire, if you ask me. But I am hoping that with more awareness being brought on by these screw ups (intentional or otherwise) may finally be the reason for the frog to leap out of the tepid water. I don't believe we will give up the benefits of sharing our location completely for the sake of privacy. The least desirable route in my opinion would be the regulatory route, where "Prescient" Uncle Sam dictates the rules. Which is why today's technology companies must collaborate in protecting the privacy of their customers, and build that in today. For them, an empty boiling pot or a dead frog, both are compelling reasons to change their ways today.
- deleted 16y ago
  [deleted]
runjake 16y ago
Allegedly responds. This supposed response came from an anonymous MacRumors.com reader: http://www.macrumors.com/2011/04/25/steve-jobs-on-ios-location-issue-we-dont-track-anyone/ http://www.macrumors.com/2011/04/25/steve-jobs-on-ios-locati...
pablasso 16y ago
I could understand the usefulness of this data to improve their designs, it's justified. But I just don't get why would they keep this data indefinitely? I don't believe they couldn't foresee that this could be a marketing disaster, people is already paranoid enough.
oxtopus 16y ago
That your cell phone reports on your location is old news -- you do have to connect to a geographically dispersed network of cell towers, after all. Assuming Apple (and other vendors) aren't using the data for evil (if at all), might it be possible that they could use that info for QA purposes? i.e. to correlate complaints and return rates to signal-related "problem areas" that they could use as leverage with the phone companies. Are we sure location info is all that is stored?
daimyoyo 16y ago
I'm not sure a glib one sentence reply, basically saying "does not!" qualifies as an effective response. I'm reminded of antennagate. "Steve, my phone loses signal." "Does not." "Yes. It does. I have video." "Well then don't hold it that way." "What?!?!?!!" "Well, since ALL phones do this, I guess we'll fix it. Sort of."
- tzs 16y ago
  It worked for Antennagate. The issue basically went away as people starting using the phones and noticed that they in fact worked fine. edit: how the heck does a simple statement of fact get downvoted? iPhone 4 is prevalent enough that even if the near complete lack of ongoing complaints in the press and blogosphere doesn't convince you, you should be able to actually ask a bunch of iPhone 4 owners. You will find that in fact the "problem" is largely a non-issue.
podperson 16y ago
If you're using Android then you're logged into your Google account all the time. Whenever you make a Google search your location is logged as part of the search data (I'm in Tuscaloosa, AL; I Google "Birmingham" and it points me to "Birmingham, AL" not "Birmingham, UK"). Google routinely logs all search query data. Google loves data. So [alleged] Jobs is right about Google and Android. As for the other stuff, who knows. Now it's important to know that if you're going to commit a crime or something that your iPhone may retain information to trip up your alibi, but that's very different from being routinely tracked by the vendor of your phone's OS. (But we all use Google and it tracks all of us, so learn to love it.)
- colanderman 16y ago
  If you're using Android then you're logged into your Google account all the time. False. Google's homepage on my Android device has a "Sign In" link at the bottom. Whenever you make a Google search your location is logged as part of the search data False. Just did it on my Android phone. It sent me to http://www.google.com/m?hl=en&gl=us&client=ms-android-tmobile-us&source=android-browser-goto&q=birmingham http://www.google.com/m?hl=en&gl=us&client=ms-androi.... Oh crap, Google knows I'm in the US. (I'm in Tuscaloosa, AL; I Google "Birmingham" and it points me to "Birmingham, AL" not "Birmingham, UK"). …because you're querying from a US IP? …because your language is set to American English instead of British English? …because Google sends your country location but nothing else? Google routinely logs all search query data. Irrelevant: since your first point is false, the logged data is anonymous.
  - kelnos 16y ago
    >>If you're using Android then you're logged into your Google account all the time. >False. Google's homepage on my Android device has a "Sign In" link at the bottom. The phone's account services, however, are indeed logged in to your Google Account at all times, assuming you associated one with your phone when you set it up. The fact that the browser app isn't logged in using the same credentials isn't relevant. I agree with your other points, though. But if Google wanted to, they could surely track your location and associate it with your Google Account. Not sure how easily they could hide that from people if that were the case, though. (I've been a happy Nexus One owner for over a year now, and I kinda just don't care either way, to be honest.)
oemera 16y ago
I don't know what Apple has but people and the media are making out of _everything_ a big thing when it has something to do with Apple. Stop it.
Ratufa 16y ago
That apple collects "non-personal" location data isn't a secret. Look at their privacy policy: http://www.apple.com/privacy/ http://www.apple.com/privacy/ Some details as to what and why they collect data was provided by Apple to Congress last year: http://markey.house.gov/docs/applemarkeybarton7-12-10.pdf http://markey.house.gov/docs/applemarkeybarton7-12-10.pdf http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Web-Services-Web-20-and-SOA/Apple-Tells-Congressmen-it-Batches-Encrypts-Location-Data-411968/ http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Web-Services-Web-20-and-SOA/Apple-T... Some additional information as to what's going on is at: http://alexlevinson.wordpress.com/2011/04/23/3-new-thoughts-on-mobile-location/ http://alexlevinson.wordpress.com/2011/04/23/3-new-thoughts-... Note the emphasis in all of this on "non-personal". As somebody else pointed out, Steve Jobs is technically correct in the statement he (supposedly) made.

17 points by domino 16y ago

Correct me if I am wrong. Jobs is technically correct. Apple does not track anyone's location. Your iphone does. And in their infinite wisdom, Apple decided to store these footprints in the phone, rather unsecurely. Stupid? Yes. And a one line response from Steve does not maketh the problem go away. This adds more fuel to the fire, if you ask me. But I am hoping that with more awareness being brought on by these screw ups (intentional or otherwise) may finally be the reason for the frog to leap out of the tepid water. I don't believe we will give up the benefits of sharing our location completely for the sake of privacy. The least desirable route in my opinion would be the regulatory route, where "Prescient" Uncle Sam dictates the rules. Which is why today's technology companies must collaborate in protecting the privacy of their customers, and build that in today. For them, an empty boiling pot or a dead frog, both are compelling reasons to change their ways today.

deleted 16y ago
[deleted]

runjake 16y ago

Allegedly responds. This supposed response came from an anonymous MacRumors.com reader: http://www.macrumors.com/2011/04/25/steve-jobs-on-ios-location-issue-we-dont-track-anyone/ http://www.macrumors.com/2011/04/25/steve-jobs-on-ios-locati...

pablasso 16y ago

I could understand the usefulness of this data to improve their designs, it's justified. But I just don't get why would they keep this data indefinitely? I don't believe they couldn't foresee that this could be a marketing disaster, people is already paranoid enough.

oxtopus 16y ago

That your cell phone reports on your location is old news -- you do have to connect to a geographically dispersed network of cell towers, after all. Assuming Apple (and other vendors) aren't using the data for evil (if at all), might it be possible that they could use that info for QA purposes? i.e. to correlate complaints and return rates to signal-related "problem areas" that they could use as leverage with the phone companies. Are we sure location info is all that is stored?

daimyoyo 16y ago

I'm not sure a glib one sentence reply, basically saying "does not!" qualifies as an effective response. I'm reminded of antennagate. "Steve, my phone loses signal." "Does not." "Yes. It does. I have video." "Well then don't hold it that way." "What?!?!?!!" "Well, since ALL phones do this, I guess we'll fix it. Sort of."

tzs 16y ago
It worked for Antennagate. The issue basically went away as people starting using the phones and noticed that they in fact worked fine. edit: how the heck does a simple statement of fact get downvoted? iPhone 4 is prevalent enough that even if the near complete lack of ongoing complaints in the press and blogosphere doesn't convince you, you should be able to actually ask a bunch of iPhone 4 owners. You will find that in fact the "problem" is largely a non-issue.

podperson 16y ago

If you're using Android then you're logged into your Google account all the time. Whenever you make a Google search your location is logged as part of the search data (I'm in Tuscaloosa, AL; I Google "Birmingham" and it points me to "Birmingham, AL" not "Birmingham, UK"). Google routinely logs all search query data. Google loves data. So [alleged] Jobs is right about Google and Android. As for the other stuff, who knows. Now it's important to know that if you're going to commit a crime or something that your iPhone may retain information to trip up your alibi, but that's very different from being routinely tracked by the vendor of your phone's OS. (But we all use Google and it tracks all of us, so learn to love it.)

colanderman 16y ago
If you're using Android then you're logged into your Google account all the time. False. Google's homepage on my Android device has a "Sign In" link at the bottom. Whenever you make a Google search your location is logged as part of the search data False. Just did it on my Android phone. It sent me to http://www.google.com/m?hl=en&gl=us&client=ms-android-tmobile-us&source=android-browser-goto&q=birmingham http://www.google.com/m?hl=en&gl=us&client=ms-androi.... Oh crap, Google knows I'm in the US. (I'm in Tuscaloosa, AL; I Google "Birmingham" and it points me to "Birmingham, AL" not "Birmingham, UK"). …because you're querying from a US IP? …because your language is set to American English instead of British English? …because Google sends your country location but nothing else? Google routinely logs all search query data. Irrelevant: since your first point is false, the logged data is anonymous.
- kelnos 16y ago
  >>If you're using Android then you're logged into your Google account all the time. >False. Google's homepage on my Android device has a "Sign In" link at the bottom. The phone's account services, however, are indeed logged in to your Google Account at all times, assuming you associated one with your phone when you set it up. The fact that the browser app isn't logged in using the same credentials isn't relevant. I agree with your other points, though. But if Google wanted to, they could surely track your location and associate it with your Google Account. Not sure how easily they could hide that from people if that were the case, though. (I've been a happy Nexus One owner for over a year now, and I kinda just don't care either way, to be honest.)

oemera 16y ago

I don't know what Apple has but people and the media are making out of _everything_ a big thing when it has something to do with Apple. Stop it.

Ratufa 16y ago

That apple collects "non-personal" location data isn't a secret. Look at their privacy policy: http://www.apple.com/privacy/ http://www.apple.com/privacy/ Some details as to what and why they collect data was provided by Apple to Congress last year: http://markey.house.gov/docs/applemarkeybarton7-12-10.pdf http://markey.house.gov/docs/applemarkeybarton7-12-10.pdf http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Web-Services-Web-20-and-SOA/Apple-Tells-Congressmen-it-Batches-Encrypts-Location-Data-411968/ http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Web-Services-Web-20-and-SOA/Apple-T... Some additional information as to what's going on is at: http://alexlevinson.wordpress.com/2011/04/23/3-new-thoughts-on-mobile-location/ http://alexlevinson.wordpress.com/2011/04/23/3-new-thoughts-... Note the emphasis in all of this on "non-personal". As somebody else pointed out, Steve Jobs is technically correct in the statement he (supposedly) made.