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> Tesla has exhausted the supply of uncritical fanboys, and is past being the only good electric car manufacturer. Now they have to compete with BMW and Mercede

by xedeon 6y ago

> Tesla has exhausted the supply of uncritical fanboys, and is past being the only good electric car manufacturer. Now they have to compete with BMW and Mercedes, who also sell good electric cars. What an odd thing to say. The objective data does not agree with you however. Pulling up EV sales in the last 5 years would also say otherwise. BMW/ MBenz are not even in the top 5 in terms of sales. Renault (Zoe) BYD, BAIC, and SAIC are closer in terms of numbers: YTD YoY Vehicle Delivery Growth: https://youtu.be/K9gk8TMXKQk?t=65 https://youtu.be/K9gk8TMXKQk?t=65 Quarterly Vehicle Deliveries: https://youtu.be/K9gk8TMXKQk?t=110 https://youtu.be/K9gk8TMXKQk?t=110 U.S. Electric Vehicles Sales by Model (2012-2019) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpsd0yRYk8c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpsd0yRYk8c "Tesla was ranked as the best-selling electric vehicle manufacturer worldwide after selling between 367,000 and 368,000 units in 2019. Tesla's sales volume translates into a market share of just under 18 percent. Chinese manufacturers BYD, BAIC, and SAIC were among the runners-up." Source: https://www.statista.com/statistics/541390/global-sales-of-plug-in-electric-vehicle-manufacturers/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/541390/global-sales-of-p... People like you have been saying that since 2008-2010 that "competition is coming" https://www.wired.com/2009/10/audi-etron/ https://www.wired.com/2009/10/audi-etron/ Yet here we are in 2020 and the incumbents still don't offer (production wise) an efficient EV that can best the range of the Model S from 2012. "Most experienced automakers race to put a car together in three years," said Angus MacKenzie, editor of Motor Trend magazine. "I can't see Tesla making more than a handful of these -- if any -- in 2012. That's not good news, considering Tesla has competition coming to the stage quickly. Nissan will sell the electric Leaf and General Motors is ready to bring the hybrid-electric Chevrolet Volt to market next year -- a year ahead of the Model S." https://money.cnn.com/2010/06/29/technology/tesla_ipo/index.htm https://money.cnn.com/2010/06/29/technology/tesla_ipo/index.... "Tesla Motors may have significant competition in the high-end electric vehicle space soon, if Fisker Automotive continues on its current path. " https://venturebeat.com/2008/09/10/high-end-electric-car-company-fisker-gets-a-65m-boost/ https://venturebeat.com/2008/09/10/high-end-electric-car-com...

diegocg 6y ago
>People like you have been saying that since 2008-2010 that "competition is coming" https://www.wired.com/2009/10/audi-etron/ https://www.wired.com/2009/10/audi-etron/ Uh, in Europe the E-tron is selling very well, arguably much better than what those critics predicted, and is one of the reasons why the sales of Model S and X are essentially disappearing in countries like Norway https://i.redd.it/amrtc9yhl9851.png https://i.redd.it/amrtc9yhl9851.png As for the range, we all know that EPA sucks and the EPA official ranges for Tesla are fake as fuck https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EUsFLHBXQAAmENE?format=jpg&name=large https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EUsFLHBXQAAmENE?format=jpg&name=... Real world testing shows that all major car manufacturers are just as competitive when it comes to battery efficiency as Tesla (it's not like Tesla's batteries are essentially different from the competition, after all)
- xedeon 6y ago
  > Model S and X are essentially disappearing in countries like Norway You conveniently left out the Model 3. It also took Audi almost a decade to finally put it to market. Moreover, the chart from Reddit that you posted is from @fly4dat from Twitter. A known EU Tesla short seller. If you've been following anything Tesla related. Ever noticed why he never post YTD or EOY numbers? There's a reason for that. > As for the range, we all know that EPA sucks and the EPA official ranges for Tesla are fake as fuck https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EUsFLHBXQAAmENE?format=jpg&name= https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EUsFLHBXQAAmENE?format=jpg&name=... Your sources are hilarious. That image is from TeslaCharts. Another short seller. See Wikipedia link below. The EPA, though sometimes inefficient like other federal orgs is the governing body on range. I trust them more than anonymous short sellers on Twitter. Many people also did real world tests that proves that Tesla is still the efficiency king. https://nextmove.de/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/3_Range_EN-Audi-etron-Tesla-Model-X-Jaguar-I-PACE-Range-Consumption-Test-nextmove.jpg https://nextmove.de/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/3_Range_EN-Au... https://nextmove.de/autobahn-test-tesla-model-x-beats-audi-e-tron-jaguar-i-pace/ https://nextmove.de/autobahn-test-tesla-model-x-beats-audi-e... https://www.kevinrooke.com/post/tesla-vehicle-efficiency https://www.kevinrooke.com/post/tesla-vehicle-efficiency https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2020/01/10/tesla-battery-range/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2020/01/10/tesla-b... https://i.imgur.com/bU71ygq.png https://i.imgur.com/bU71ygq.png From: https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/cevc99/ev_core_efficiency_comparison_chart/ https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/cevc99/ev_core... "TSLAQ is a loose, international collective of largely anonymous short-sellers.... The group was the subject of a Real Vision video which included interviews with prominent members @TESLACharts and @Paul91701736.[8]" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TSLAQ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TSLAQ > all major car manufacturers are just as competitive when it comes to battery efficiency as Tesla You clearly don't even understand the engineering aspect here. The efficiency is from the drivetrain, motors and software. Not "batteries". This is why Teslas can go further than their competitors. While still maintaining the performance specs. Even though they may sometimes have smaller batteries.
  - diegocg 6y ago
    >You conveniently left out the Model 3. No, I did not? See the links I attached again.

by xedeon 6y ago

diegocg 6y ago

>People like you have been saying that since 2008-2010 that "competition is coming" https://www.wired.com/2009/10/audi-etron/ https://www.wired.com/2009/10/audi-etron/ Uh, in Europe the E-tron is selling very well, arguably much better than what those critics predicted, and is one of the reasons why the sales of Model S and X are essentially disappearing in countries like Norway https://i.redd.it/amrtc9yhl9851.png https://i.redd.it/amrtc9yhl9851.png As for the range, we all know that EPA sucks and the EPA official ranges for Tesla are fake as fuck https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EUsFLHBXQAAmENE?format=jpg&name=large https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EUsFLHBXQAAmENE?format=jpg&name=... Real world testing shows that all major car manufacturers are just as competitive when it comes to battery efficiency as Tesla (it's not like Tesla's batteries are essentially different from the competition, after all)

xedeon 6y ago
> Model S and X are essentially disappearing in countries like Norway You conveniently left out the Model 3. It also took Audi almost a decade to finally put it to market. Moreover, the chart from Reddit that you posted is from @fly4dat from Twitter. A known EU Tesla short seller. If you've been following anything Tesla related. Ever noticed why he never post YTD or EOY numbers? There's a reason for that. > As for the range, we all know that EPA sucks and the EPA official ranges for Tesla are fake as fuck https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EUsFLHBXQAAmENE?format=jpg&name= https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EUsFLHBXQAAmENE?format=jpg&name=... Your sources are hilarious. That image is from TeslaCharts. Another short seller. See Wikipedia link below. The EPA, though sometimes inefficient like other federal orgs is the governing body on range. I trust them more than anonymous short sellers on Twitter. Many people also did real world tests that proves that Tesla is still the efficiency king. https://nextmove.de/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/3_Range_EN-Audi-etron-Tesla-Model-X-Jaguar-I-PACE-Range-Consumption-Test-nextmove.jpg https://nextmove.de/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/3_Range_EN-Au... https://nextmove.de/autobahn-test-tesla-model-x-beats-audi-e-tron-jaguar-i-pace/ https://nextmove.de/autobahn-test-tesla-model-x-beats-audi-e... https://www.kevinrooke.com/post/tesla-vehicle-efficiency https://www.kevinrooke.com/post/tesla-vehicle-efficiency https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2020/01/10/tesla-battery-range/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2020/01/10/tesla-b... https://i.imgur.com/bU71ygq.png https://i.imgur.com/bU71ygq.png From: https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/cevc99/ev_core_efficiency_comparison_chart/ https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/cevc99/ev_core... "TSLAQ is a loose, international collective of largely anonymous short-sellers.... The group was the subject of a Real Vision video which included interviews with prominent members @TESLACharts and @Paul91701736.[8]" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TSLAQ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TSLAQ > all major car manufacturers are just as competitive when it comes to battery efficiency as Tesla You clearly don't even understand the engineering aspect here. The efficiency is from the drivetrain, motors and software. Not "batteries". This is why Teslas can go further than their competitors. While still maintaining the performance specs. Even though they may sometimes have smaller batteries.
- diegocg 6y ago
  >You conveniently left out the Model 3. No, I did not? See the links I attached again.