5 ms·

I can appreciate the effort in allowing windows games to run under linux, but can't actually see the point. Whilst Valve was pushing to create their own OS/eco

by goldcd 6y ago

I can appreciate the effort in allowing windows games to run under linux, but can't actually see the point. Whilst Valve was pushing to create their own OS/ecosystem, it did make sense - but even then there was a niggling feeling they just wanted to make their own walled-garden. To a gamer today, a windows license is cheap (maybe $10) and 'everything works' - you can happily dual-boot/VM for non-gaming if that suits you better. Happy to be corrected if I'm missing out on anything - but can't think there are many people saying "Great - now I can finally buy RDR2"

dx87 6y ago
I think it's mainly as a safety net in case Microsoft decides to only allow applications to be installed through their own store. IIRC, that was the original reason they started work on SteamOS. They're also working on their own cloud streaming platform, so they might figure it's cheaper to develop Proton than have to pay for a bunch of Windows Server licenses.
- goldcd 6y ago
  Actually, that makes sense. I don't think MS will ever (as much as they'd like to) make us use their store - but "steam-stream" is at a massive disadvantage if they need to submit to whatever MS asks for in license (and presume nVidia, google and anybody who isn't Sony - so Steam would end up with something pretty valuable)
  - dogma1138 6y ago
    They already did to some extent with Xbox Game Pass Ultimate. I haven’t really bought any games recently because of it, and unlike the other premium pay monthly gaming services Xbox Game Pass actually brings on a lot of new games. With Microsoft buying more and more studios and the fact that they pretty much releasing most of not of all their first party new games on the pass combined with a persistent library of a lot of older games it’s a game changer for me. Basically with Game Pass Ultimate you can currently play games on your Xbox, PC and mobile device (via streaming) all for $15. It’s by far the biggest mover Microsoft has and what I see giving them a huge edge this coming generation over Sony. Microsoft also doesn’t care anymore about Xbox hardware exclusives they see Xbox as their cross platform gaming brand now.
chacha2 6y ago
What's there to understand? This is like saying why buy an iPhone when you can just get an Android.
ordx 6y ago
Windows Home is $140, not cheap even for the US and certainly not cheap for poorer countries. Where did you see $10?
- dx87 6y ago
  You can buy grey market keys off ebay, but that's the only way you're getting a $10 license.
  - goldcd 6y ago
    Just that - Win 10 Pro keys are dirt cheap from many online key sellers - and just work. I suspect that and OEM sales are how 99% of windows licenses are now sold - unless you know of people who buy them in a box from a store. Was a little bit 'worrisome' before that MS might clamp down - but the last decade of 'free updates' and 'Win 10 will just evolve' indicates their thinking. Windows is near-as-damnit a free platform (which MS can then use as upsell from)
    - viraptor 6y ago
      And now that you can just install windows 10 pro and click "nah, I'll give you the license code later", many people won't even bother. As far as I can tell, the message in the corner is the only issue without activation.
    - bitwize 6y ago
      Windows 10 is pretty much shareware at this point. You can download the full version for $0, just with features knocked out until you pay to "register".
  - wpdev_63 6y ago
    Those are volume licenses that are given to microsoft partners for mass deployment. At some point those keys can/will be revoked when they reach a certain number of activations.
    - 6y ago
podiki 6y ago
Some of us just prefer to be in Linux [0]. And either way, you're likely using your computer the vast majority of time for non-gaming related stuff. I for one don't want to dual boot to play for a few minutes, or really have to do anything in Windows, games or not. As a commenter below points out, it's a choice. [0] https://boilingsteam.com/my-journey-to-finally-ditching-windows-for-good/ https://boilingsteam.com/my-journey-to-finally-ditching-wind...
eitland 6y ago
> To a gamer today, a windows license is cheap (maybe $10) and 'everything works' TLDR: Many people don't trust Microsoft. Full: New Microsoft seems really nice but (fortunately) they always keeps reminding us who they really are: - Put ads on my start menu or login screen, even if I have the extra expensive "Professional" license. - Poorly hidden attempts at strangling non-store distribution of open source software like Krita (discussed the other day). - Inviting an open source developer of a popular packaging tool for a talk, developing their own and then ghosting him and launching their own. - Relentlessly pushing Edge until they cave in and push Edge as a frontend to Chromium - etc Warning, slight hyperbole ahead: Some people at Microsoft do some really great work (Azure, VSCode etc). Sadly for them they seems to have to fight another part of the company that desperately miss being despised and desperately miss the thrill of multiple ongoing high profile lawsuits for monopoly abuse.
brnt 6y ago
The problemen with dual booting is that it is a barrier. Takes a few minutes or so (don't forget the update avalanche if you havnt booted into your Windows partition for a while, and steam+games itself). With Proton I finally fully switched, I can play at least half of my games, any time I want. Its great.
- kevincox 6y ago
  Plus when I'm playing games I also have my browser open (Music, Calls, ...) so now I need two browser configs (or to carefully share them between OSes). Of course if I use non-web things for any of the listed activities now I need two installs of those. Honestly when I wanted to game on Windows I usually just used a VM (with GPU passthough) as it was nice to have my preferred environment still up and running. I haven't tried to play a Windows only game in a while but dual booting was definitely a pain that I would try to avoid.

by goldcd 6y ago

dx87 6y ago

I think it's mainly as a safety net in case Microsoft decides to only allow applications to be installed through their own store. IIRC, that was the original reason they started work on SteamOS. They're also working on their own cloud streaming platform, so they might figure it's cheaper to develop Proton than have to pay for a bunch of Windows Server licenses.

goldcd 6y ago
Actually, that makes sense. I don't think MS will ever (as much as they'd like to) make us use their store - but "steam-stream" is at a massive disadvantage if they need to submit to whatever MS asks for in license (and presume nVidia, google and anybody who isn't Sony - so Steam would end up with something pretty valuable)
- dogma1138 6y ago
  They already did to some extent with Xbox Game Pass Ultimate. I haven’t really bought any games recently because of it, and unlike the other premium pay monthly gaming services Xbox Game Pass actually brings on a lot of new games. With Microsoft buying more and more studios and the fact that they pretty much releasing most of not of all their first party new games on the pass combined with a persistent library of a lot of older games it’s a game changer for me. Basically with Game Pass Ultimate you can currently play games on your Xbox, PC and mobile device (via streaming) all for $15. It’s by far the biggest mover Microsoft has and what I see giving them a huge edge this coming generation over Sony. Microsoft also doesn’t care anymore about Xbox hardware exclusives they see Xbox as their cross platform gaming brand now.

chacha2 6y ago

What's there to understand? This is like saying why buy an iPhone when you can just get an Android.

ordx 6y ago

Windows Home is $140, not cheap even for the US and certainly not cheap for poorer countries. Where did you see $10?

dx87 6y ago
You can buy grey market keys off ebay, but that's the only way you're getting a $10 license.
- goldcd 6y ago
  Just that - Win 10 Pro keys are dirt cheap from many online key sellers - and just work. I suspect that and OEM sales are how 99% of windows licenses are now sold - unless you know of people who buy them in a box from a store. Was a little bit 'worrisome' before that MS might clamp down - but the last decade of 'free updates' and 'Win 10 will just evolve' indicates their thinking. Windows is near-as-damnit a free platform (which MS can then use as upsell from)
  - viraptor 6y ago
    And now that you can just install windows 10 pro and click "nah, I'll give you the license code later", many people won't even bother. As far as I can tell, the message in the corner is the only issue without activation.
  - bitwize 6y ago
    Windows 10 is pretty much shareware at this point. You can download the full version for $0, just with features knocked out until you pay to "register".
- wpdev_63 6y ago
  Those are volume licenses that are given to microsoft partners for mass deployment. At some point those keys can/will be revoked when they reach a certain number of activations.
  - 6y ago

podiki 6y ago

Some of us just prefer to be in Linux [0]. And either way, you're likely using your computer the vast majority of time for non-gaming related stuff. I for one don't want to dual boot to play for a few minutes, or really have to do anything in Windows, games or not. As a commenter below points out, it's a choice. [0] https://boilingsteam.com/my-journey-to-finally-ditching-windows-for-good/ https://boilingsteam.com/my-journey-to-finally-ditching-wind...

eitland 6y ago

> To a gamer today, a windows license is cheap (maybe $10) and 'everything works' TLDR: Many people don't trust Microsoft. Full: New Microsoft seems really nice but (fortunately) they always keeps reminding us who they really are: - Put ads on my start menu or login screen, even if I have the extra expensive "Professional" license. - Poorly hidden attempts at strangling non-store distribution of open source software like Krita (discussed the other day). - Inviting an open source developer of a popular packaging tool for a talk, developing their own and then ghosting him and launching their own. - Relentlessly pushing Edge until they cave in and push Edge as a frontend to Chromium - etc Warning, slight hyperbole ahead: Some people at Microsoft do some really great work (Azure, VSCode etc). Sadly for them they seems to have to fight another part of the company that desperately miss being despised and desperately miss the thrill of multiple ongoing high profile lawsuits for monopoly abuse.

brnt 6y ago

The problemen with dual booting is that it is a barrier. Takes a few minutes or so (don't forget the update avalanche if you havnt booted into your Windows partition for a while, and steam+games itself). With Proton I finally fully switched, I can play at least half of my games, any time I want. Its great.

kevincox 6y ago
Plus when I'm playing games I also have my browser open (Music, Calls, ...) so now I need two browser configs (or to carefully share them between OSes). Of course if I use non-web things for any of the listed activities now I need two installs of those. Honestly when I wanted to game on Windows I usually just used a VM (with GPU passthough) as it was nice to have my preferred environment still up and running. I haven't tried to play a Windows only game in a while but dual booting was definitely a pain that I would try to avoid.