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> I honestly dont understand their strategy. But you do. See you got it here: > Only option I can see is to maintain isolation until a vaccine is available W

> I honestly dont understand their strategy. But you do. See you got it here: > Only option I can see is to maintain isolation until a vaccine is available What puzzles me is why you don't see this as the only good strategy for any country that has the capacity to attempt it. It's the strategy that saves most lives. There are currently 10 countries in the Pacific, including NZ, that have no COVID cases. They could form a bubble and allow travel between them. Yesterday kiwis were allowed to fly to Australia and enter the general population without quarantine.

konjin 6y ago
Because waiting for a new invention as part of policy is idiotic. Science does not work a on schedule. A vaccine is not 12 months away, it can be invented tomorrow, or it can never be invented because it never becomes more than 5% effective.
- markdown 6y ago
  And so they'll be holed up a while. So? The vast majority of humans never leave their countries their entire lives. If the time comes that they're willing to let their elders die so the wealthiest among them can travel or fOr tHE eCoNOmY, they can always open up their borders. What they have is a choice. They had their elections last night and governing party was re-elected by a landslide, which means the people are happy with their current strategy. > waiting for a new invention as part of policy is idiotic. Saving lives and buying time is not idiotic.
  - konjin 6y ago
    >The vast majority of humans never leave their countries their entire lives. The majority of people in New Zealand are 0th of 1st generation immigrants. The majority leave the country at least once a year and have multiple citizenships. >Saving lives and buying time is not idiotic. Yes, Queen Victoria buying time for the invention of penicillin is idiotic.
    - EdwardDiego 6y ago
      You're making some interesting claims there. Got any sources?
      - konjin 6y ago
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_to_New_Zealand#Recent_years https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_to_New_Zealand#Rec... The 2018 census in particular has 28% of current NZ citizens of being 0th generation citizens. They have something like 30% for people with one 0th generation parent: https://www.stats.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/2018-Census-totals-by-topic/Download-data/2018-census-totals-by-topic-national-highlights.xlsx https://www.stats.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/2018-Census-totals-... So it's closer to 60% of citizen being attached to another country.
- onli 6y ago
  NZ can wait. If it really turns out that there is no vaccine they can still try different strategies. Until then, this is the best possible option a country could pick.
secondcoming 6y ago
> Yesterday kiwis were allowed to fly to Australia and enter the general population without quarantine. The Australian general population? That's fine, it's getting back in to NZ that's the issue. There will come a point where lives will be sacrificed in order to get economies going again. It's harsh, but true. Has NZ's economy escaped unscathed? I'd imaging that tourism is quite a large part of their GDP; but if I as a tourist have to quarantine for two weeks on arrival there's really not much point in visiting NZ at all. Once the rest of the world starts operating again, vaccine or not, NZ will have to follow and relax their isolation. They're hoping that by the time that comes there'll be a vaccine or better treatments. But there's no guarantee of that. The rest of the world will be in the position where those who would have died from Covid have already probably died, but NZ won't.
- markdown 6y ago
  > The rest of the world will be in the position where those who would have died from Covid have already probably died, but NZ won't. People who've survived COVID can get it again and die the second time: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-twice-death-dutch-woman/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-twice-death-dutch-woman/
  - secondcoming 6y ago
    Yes. The main point in the article is that an 'eldery woman... with rare cancer.. and receiving chemotherapy' died after getting covid a second time. Most people now who get it aren't dying. The number of positive test cases is skyrocketing, but deaths aren't. There'll come a point where only death rates will used to judge whether lockdowns should continue or not, not infection rates.
    - iso947 6y ago
      Deaths in the U.K. are ballooning, as are hospital patients.
      - secondcoming 6y ago

konjin 6y ago

Because waiting for a new invention as part of policy is idiotic. Science does not work a on schedule. A vaccine is not 12 months away, it can be invented tomorrow, or it can never be invented because it never becomes more than 5% effective.

markdown 6y ago
And so they'll be holed up a while. So? The vast majority of humans never leave their countries their entire lives. If the time comes that they're willing to let their elders die so the wealthiest among them can travel or fOr tHE eCoNOmY, they can always open up their borders. What they have is a choice. They had their elections last night and governing party was re-elected by a landslide, which means the people are happy with their current strategy. > waiting for a new invention as part of policy is idiotic. Saving lives and buying time is not idiotic.
- konjin 6y ago
  >The vast majority of humans never leave their countries their entire lives. The majority of people in New Zealand are 0th of 1st generation immigrants. The majority leave the country at least once a year and have multiple citizenships. >Saving lives and buying time is not idiotic. Yes, Queen Victoria buying time for the invention of penicillin is idiotic.
  - EdwardDiego 6y ago
    You're making some interesting claims there. Got any sources?
    - konjin 6y ago
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_to_New_Zealand#Recent_years https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_to_New_Zealand#Rec... The 2018 census in particular has 28% of current NZ citizens of being 0th generation citizens. They have something like 30% for people with one 0th generation parent: https://www.stats.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/2018-Census-totals-by-topic/Download-data/2018-census-totals-by-topic-national-highlights.xlsx https://www.stats.govt.nz/assets/Uploads/2018-Census-totals-... So it's closer to 60% of citizen being attached to another country.
onli 6y ago
NZ can wait. If it really turns out that there is no vaccine they can still try different strategies. Until then, this is the best possible option a country could pick.

secondcoming 6y ago

> Yesterday kiwis were allowed to fly to Australia and enter the general population without quarantine. The Australian general population? That's fine, it's getting back in to NZ that's the issue. There will come a point where lives will be sacrificed in order to get economies going again. It's harsh, but true. Has NZ's economy escaped unscathed? I'd imaging that tourism is quite a large part of their GDP; but if I as a tourist have to quarantine for two weeks on arrival there's really not much point in visiting NZ at all. Once the rest of the world starts operating again, vaccine or not, NZ will have to follow and relax their isolation. They're hoping that by the time that comes there'll be a vaccine or better treatments. But there's no guarantee of that. The rest of the world will be in the position where those who would have died from Covid have already probably died, but NZ won't.

markdown 6y ago
> The rest of the world will be in the position where those who would have died from Covid have already probably died, but NZ won't. People who've survived COVID can get it again and die the second time: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-twice-death-dutch-woman/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-twice-death-dutch-woman/
- secondcoming 6y ago
  Yes. The main point in the article is that an 'eldery woman... with rare cancer.. and receiving chemotherapy' died after getting covid a second time. Most people now who get it aren't dying. The number of positive test cases is skyrocketing, but deaths aren't. There'll come a point where only death rates will used to judge whether lockdowns should continue or not, not infection rates.
  - iso947 6y ago
    Deaths in the U.K. are ballooning, as are hospital patients.
    - secondcoming 6y ago