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I have no faith in what my vote can do in regards to things like this. Paying attention doesn't do much. If the government wants to pass something, especially

I have no faith in what my vote can do in regards to things like this. Paying attention doesn't do much. If the government wants to pass something, especially in the name of national security, it will get passed.

uselesscynicism 6y ago
Then what? If you can't vote to get the change that you want, what's the alternative? Violent revolution and hoping that the new boss is better than the old boss? I'm so tired of this kind of useless cynicism. Voting matters, especially at the local level. You can get involved in your party at local levels, too. How do you think all these politicians get into the political class to begin with, in free societies? Or should we overthrow our democratically elected government, because you believe cynically there's no point in voting, they're going to do whatever they want anyway, and install a dictatorship or Party and hope that we get a benevolent one? Or are you suggesting that the Socialist Utopia is right around the bend, if we all just give up on voting and... I don't know, what's the point of your comment?
- prepend 6y ago
  I think that I see a lot of “convenient delusions” posted. Here’s my current theory... I think people want to be seen as virtuous. Stuff is bad. People want positive change. Either they don’t know what to do or making change is too hard. So they say that change is impossible. Based on the really high rates of obesity, I think more people know what to do, but it’s hard, and they don’t do it. I know what I should do (eat less, exercise) but I don’t.
- crocodiletears 6y ago
  It's not useless cynicism, it's a sober approach. Understanding that the influence of politicians is delimited by their knowledge, the as well as monied, and bureaucratic interests. I vote in every election I can, national to local. But ultimately you have to understand that in most cases, unless you're willing to dedicate your life to political advocacy (an exhausting route filled with small corruptions, traps of necessity that threaten your principals, and unpleasant people) you're choosing to adjust the angle of the rudder within a certain margin, not the trajectory or shape of the ship.
- 0xdeadb00f 6y ago
  I don't deny that voting matters. And I still vote for those who share my ideals. But my point is that voting isn't everything - the government can do whatever they want in the name of national security. Which is an obvious problem, but something that they can scare monger people into agreeing with.
jjones2 6y ago
And to top it off, Hillary literally put the idea on the table that it would be just fine to drone strike journalist Julian Assange: https://archive.vn/DrLRO https://archive.vn/DrLRO So no, zero faith for things like laws to keep the government in check.
- takinola 6y ago
  I would take this claim with a giant grain of salt. Assange was in an European city not on a farm in a middle eastern country. Ethics aside, this would be very difficult to operationalize even if it was seriously considered.
  - jjones2 6y ago
    You can take it with whatever grain you wish, but it doesn't change the fact that the government will throw all rules out the window when they want to get their way. A quote: “We came, we saw, he died!” she exclaimed." - Hillary on the murder of Colonel Qaddafi https://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/28/us/politics/libya-isis-hillary-clinton.html https://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/28/us/politics/libya-isis-hi... (A NYT sourced article, just for you)

uselesscynicism 6y ago

Then what? If you can't vote to get the change that you want, what's the alternative? Violent revolution and hoping that the new boss is better than the old boss? I'm so tired of this kind of useless cynicism. Voting matters, especially at the local level. You can get involved in your party at local levels, too. How do you think all these politicians get into the political class to begin with, in free societies? Or should we overthrow our democratically elected government, because you believe cynically there's no point in voting, they're going to do whatever they want anyway, and install a dictatorship or Party and hope that we get a benevolent one? Or are you suggesting that the Socialist Utopia is right around the bend, if we all just give up on voting and... I don't know, what's the point of your comment?

prepend 6y ago
I think that I see a lot of “convenient delusions” posted. Here’s my current theory... I think people want to be seen as virtuous. Stuff is bad. People want positive change. Either they don’t know what to do or making change is too hard. So they say that change is impossible. Based on the really high rates of obesity, I think more people know what to do, but it’s hard, and they don’t do it. I know what I should do (eat less, exercise) but I don’t.
crocodiletears 6y ago
It's not useless cynicism, it's a sober approach. Understanding that the influence of politicians is delimited by their knowledge, the as well as monied, and bureaucratic interests. I vote in every election I can, national to local. But ultimately you have to understand that in most cases, unless you're willing to dedicate your life to political advocacy (an exhausting route filled with small corruptions, traps of necessity that threaten your principals, and unpleasant people) you're choosing to adjust the angle of the rudder within a certain margin, not the trajectory or shape of the ship.
0xdeadb00f 6y ago
I don't deny that voting matters. And I still vote for those who share my ideals. But my point is that voting isn't everything - the government can do whatever they want in the name of national security. Which is an obvious problem, but something that they can scare monger people into agreeing with.

jjones2 6y ago

And to top it off, Hillary literally put the idea on the table that it would be just fine to drone strike journalist Julian Assange: https://archive.vn/DrLRO https://archive.vn/DrLRO So no, zero faith for things like laws to keep the government in check.

takinola 6y ago
I would take this claim with a giant grain of salt. Assange was in an European city not on a farm in a middle eastern country. Ethics aside, this would be very difficult to operationalize even if it was seriously considered.
- jjones2 6y ago
  You can take it with whatever grain you wish, but it doesn't change the fact that the government will throw all rules out the window when they want to get their way. A quote: “We came, we saw, he died!” she exclaimed." - Hillary on the murder of Colonel Qaddafi https://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/28/us/politics/libya-isis-hillary-clinton.html https://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/28/us/politics/libya-isis-hi... (A NYT sourced article, just for you)