5 ms·

It makes me cringe to see the original title changed from "developing" to "third world" country. The term was originally used to either distinguish countries n

by rlander 15y ago

It makes me cringe to see the original title changed from "developing" to "third world" country. The term was originally used to either distinguish countries non-aligned with either capitalism or communism during the cold war but has since gained an economic connotation and become synonymous with "poor". The Philippines is a capitalist country and consequently doesn't fit the first definition; it most definitely is not poor, so it also doesn't fit the last.

twidlit 15y ago
Wasn't aware of the connotation and have used both interchangeably.
mbenjaminsmith 15y ago
I think it shows a profound ignorance of how the world works. I hear it all the time living in Thailand. To put that in perspective, Thailand ranks 23rd by GDP, has a literacy rate in the high 90s and has an unemployment rate of around 1%. The average professional does make around half of what they would in the US, but their taxes are lower and their cost of living is also half or less. The health care cost/quality ratio makes many countries look barbaric. I think "third world" could be safely replaced with "economy I know nothing about" in the majority of cases.
- twidlit 15y ago
  So 'developing country' would be the correct one for Thailand then?
  - mbenjaminsmith 15y ago
    Why don't you just call it Thailand? That's what most people call it.
- jbellis 15y ago
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_... puts Thailand in the 80s in GDP per capita. The Philippines is 125, 113, or 132 depending on the list. All three lists agree that Thailand has less than 1/4 of US GDP, and the Philippines has less half of Thailand's, putting it on the edge of the bottom quartile. So jumping down someone's throat for calling the RP a poor country looks a little premature to me. (I lived there for two years and my gut feeling doesn't disagree with that, although if you've only been to Makati I can see how you might not realize that.) That said, to me "3rd-world" has pejorative connotations regardless of income levels, and I also wish the submitter had left the title alone.
  - mbenjaminsmith 15y ago
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP) Quote: "Using a PPP basis is arguably more useful when comparing generalized differences in living standards on the whole between nations because PPP takes into account the relative cost of living and the inflation rates of the countries, rather than using just exchange rates which may distort the real differences in income." Thailand ranks #24, #23 and #24 in those lists. I rounded up. You picked a list to illustrate your point (that Thailand and the Philippines are poor?). I picked one that better reflected GDP vs cost of living, which was my point. I wasn't jumping down his throat specifically, I was saying that the term "third world" as applied to Thailand (and other countries) is a worthless description today. As the original commenter pointed out, it's related to the geopolitics of the Cold War. People often swap it for "developing nation" which is a euphemism for "undeveloped by Western standards" which I think is condescending and a culturally biased value judgement. When someone says "third world" I would say they either don't really understand the economics involved or are deliberately being derogatory to another people/nation. I think that's pretty safely called ignorance.
    - wcarss 15y ago
      The PPP is not without flaws for these uses; compare the average standard of life in China or India to the average standard of life in the Netherlands or Canada, and compare their PPP rankings. If you're looking to compare quality of life, while not perfect, I would imagine the Human Development Index would be closer in line with average experience: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Development_Index http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Development_Index
    - yummyfajitas 15y ago
      Your list corrects for cost of living, but does not correct for population. On your list, Liechtenstein ranks as 159. Lichtenstein has a GDP per capita of $91k/year (PPP adjusted), but $91k/year x 36k people doesn't amount to much. Does that make them poor? By contrast, Thailand's GDP per capita is just under $4k/year (PPP adjusted), about 1/20 that of Liechtenstein.
kloncks 15y ago
Relevant TED Talk: http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/eng/hans_rosling_shows_the_best_stats_you_ve_ever_seen.html http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/eng/hans_rosling_shows_the_bes...

by rlander 15y ago

twidlit 15y ago

Wasn't aware of the connotation and have used both interchangeably.

mbenjaminsmith 15y ago

I think it shows a profound ignorance of how the world works. I hear it all the time living in Thailand. To put that in perspective, Thailand ranks 23rd by GDP, has a literacy rate in the high 90s and has an unemployment rate of around 1%. The average professional does make around half of what they would in the US, but their taxes are lower and their cost of living is also half or less. The health care cost/quality ratio makes many countries look barbaric. I think "third world" could be safely replaced with "economy I know nothing about" in the majority of cases.

twidlit 15y ago
So 'developing country' would be the correct one for Thailand then?
- mbenjaminsmith 15y ago
  Why don't you just call it Thailand? That's what most people call it.
jbellis 15y ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_... puts Thailand in the 80s in GDP per capita. The Philippines is 125, 113, or 132 depending on the list. All three lists agree that Thailand has less than 1/4 of US GDP, and the Philippines has less half of Thailand's, putting it on the edge of the bottom quartile. So jumping down someone's throat for calling the RP a poor country looks a little premature to me. (I lived there for two years and my gut feeling doesn't disagree with that, although if you've only been to Makati I can see how you might not realize that.) That said, to me "3rd-world" has pejorative connotations regardless of income levels, and I also wish the submitter had left the title alone.
- mbenjaminsmith 15y ago
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP) Quote: "Using a PPP basis is arguably more useful when comparing generalized differences in living standards on the whole between nations because PPP takes into account the relative cost of living and the inflation rates of the countries, rather than using just exchange rates which may distort the real differences in income." Thailand ranks #24, #23 and #24 in those lists. I rounded up. You picked a list to illustrate your point (that Thailand and the Philippines are poor?). I picked one that better reflected GDP vs cost of living, which was my point. I wasn't jumping down his throat specifically, I was saying that the term "third world" as applied to Thailand (and other countries) is a worthless description today. As the original commenter pointed out, it's related to the geopolitics of the Cold War. People often swap it for "developing nation" which is a euphemism for "undeveloped by Western standards" which I think is condescending and a culturally biased value judgement. When someone says "third world" I would say they either don't really understand the economics involved or are deliberately being derogatory to another people/nation. I think that's pretty safely called ignorance.
  - wcarss 15y ago
    The PPP is not without flaws for these uses; compare the average standard of life in China or India to the average standard of life in the Netherlands or Canada, and compare their PPP rankings. If you're looking to compare quality of life, while not perfect, I would imagine the Human Development Index would be closer in line with average experience: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Development_Index http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Development_Index
  - yummyfajitas 15y ago
    Your list corrects for cost of living, but does not correct for population. On your list, Liechtenstein ranks as 159. Lichtenstein has a GDP per capita of $91k/year (PPP adjusted), but $91k/year x 36k people doesn't amount to much. Does that make them poor? By contrast, Thailand's GDP per capita is just under $4k/year (PPP adjusted), about 1/20 that of Liechtenstein.

kloncks 15y ago

Relevant TED Talk: http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/eng/hans_rosling_shows_the_best_stats_you_ve_ever_seen.html http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/eng/hans_rosling_shows_the_bes...