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> Eventually Silicon Valley will end up like Detroit, with abandoned 4-over-1 condo complexes and empty office parks where the software industry once stood. Th

> Eventually Silicon Valley will end up like Detroit, with abandoned 4-over-1 condo complexes and empty office parks where the software industry once stood. This happened to Detroit because jobs were literally the only reason to live there. The Bay Area has amazing weather, unbelievable scenery, world-class recreation, and tons of music and culture. If the jobs of today leave, the jobs of tomorrow will replace them simply because the area itself is one of the best in the country. Detroit is a flatland nowhere in frozen tundra flyover state. "A bunch of lakes" is only going to keep an extremely small subset of people interested.

Apocryphon 6y ago
Yeah, it's like if LA was to lose the entertainment industry, the Mediterranean climate alone ensures it a highly desirable place to live. And both SF and LA are major ports.
ardy42 6y ago
> The Bay Area has amazing weather, unbelievable scenery, world-class recreation, and tons of music and culture. If the jobs of today leave, the jobs of tomorrow will replace them simply because the area itself is one of the best in the country. That's not necessarily true. Maybe the jobs go and never return, but the recreational desirability leads it more in the direction of an Aspen: more of a place for recreation than business.
OkGoDoIt 6y ago
My job is the main reason I live in San Francisco. In my opinion Colorado is much more beautiful, Boulder has a lot of the advantages of living in a big city but also so many fewer disadvantages. Personally I’m not a big fan of the kind of nature of the bay area has to offer. I grew up in the Northeast and the southeast, and I miss the huge deciduous trees and the fall-time colors. The Bay Area is pretty, but doesn’t hold a candle to the beauty of Michigan or Colorado or Tahoe in my opinion. Obviously different people have different preferences, but for every person who believes the bay area is the perfect place to live regardless of their career, there’s at least another person who doesn’t particularly like it and has their own idea of a perfect place to live.
- arethuza 6y ago
  For what its worth, I'm not from the US but I have travelled a fair bit round the US and Colorado and Boulder were some of the few places that really appealed to me.
- bosswipe 6y ago
  Throwing in Tahoe kind of disproves your point because Tahoe is one of the reasons to live here, it's a very popular weekend trip.
  - OkGoDoIt 6y ago
    I meant living in Tahoe. I’ve done the weekend trip from SF a few times and with the long drive, the traffic (everyone has the same idea), the cost of hotel, trying to fit everything in a couple days, etc, I find it more stressful to take a weekend trip there than I find it enjoyable. Living there would be great but calling it a perk of living in San Francisco is a bit of a stretch for me. If your criteria for a good place to live is having a beautiful place within a 4 hour drive, then a lot of the USA is included in that. I want to live in the nice, beautiful, low-stress place. But again, it seems to be a very personal preference. Maybe for some people having the ability to drive 4 hours to get somewhere amazing is a good balance to the things they love about living in San Francisco. I don’t consider it close enough to be a factor in my opinion of SF though. Edit: I’m not trying to get into an argument about how amazing or horrible the Bay Area is. I’m just saying that some people find it amazing but other people actually would prefer to live in (the suburbs of) Detroit or elsewhere. I have no idea the percent of people in each group, but I don’t think we should take for a given than if all big industry leaves the Bay Area, that it will still be as popular as it is today. Not everyone loves it that much.
    - throwaway0a5e 6y ago
      >I want to live in the nice, beautiful, low-stress place As long as whatever you consider nice is the same as whatever every other similarly paid white collar worker with a spouse and 1.75 kids considers nice you will never be able to get that. Those places always will be overprices and high stress. Look at how Boston area money has shit up Cape Cod, southern Maine and NH. NYC money has shit up all of Long Island, large parts of PA, upstate and VT. CA money has shit up Colorado so bad that CO money shits all over Utah. Chicago money shits all over Wisconsin. What you're really trying to get away from is the secondary effects of people like you (and me, and most everyone on HN). You're trying to get away from a service and tourism economy where everyone else is (somewhat rightfully) out to screw you for every dollar you're worth. Unless you have radically different tastes in what you want this will never be possible because all the other people of the same means will gravitate toward the same places.
vharuck 6y ago
>The Bay Area has amazing weather, unbelievable scenery, world-class recreation, and tons of music and culture. The weather will persist, but the rest are qualities of cities with large populations who have lots of disposable income.
- microtherion 6y ago
  I agree regarding music & culture. Detroit used to have awesome music, e.g. Motown Records in its heyday, and even when in decline, it was considered one of the birthplaces of techno.
  - Apocryphon 6y ago
    And during the last gasp of rock at the beginning of the 21st century, Detroit brought us the White Stripes!
- seattle_spring 6y ago
  Unbelievable scenery and world-class recreation have nothing to do with being a "city with a large population." In fact, the presence of a large population center usually makes these things worse.
cvhashim 6y ago
> tons of music and culture High living costs and living conditions will have the starving artists that make these things you consume flock somewhere else or never move out to the Bay in the first place. Consequently the next generation of these artists won't be coming out of the bay, ironically you'll start to see more culture and art come out of places like Detroit.
- RC_ITR 6y ago
  I think you're conflating avant-garde with world class. Take restaurants for example - super easy to start a new inventive restaurant in Detroit (low rent, low labor costs, etc.), but it's nearly impossible to make a $500/head prix-fixe work there (and that is, for better of worse, the type of food that causes people to flock now-a-days). Even Portland sees most of it's 'starving artist' chefs decamp to NY / SF / LA once they gain a national brand.
jdmg94 6y ago
weather alone is not worth the current housing prices in California, specially considering how we're actively fucking up climate.

Apocryphon 6y ago

Yeah, it's like if LA was to lose the entertainment industry, the Mediterranean climate alone ensures it a highly desirable place to live. And both SF and LA are major ports.

ardy42 6y ago

> The Bay Area has amazing weather, unbelievable scenery, world-class recreation, and tons of music and culture. If the jobs of today leave, the jobs of tomorrow will replace them simply because the area itself is one of the best in the country. That's not necessarily true. Maybe the jobs go and never return, but the recreational desirability leads it more in the direction of an Aspen: more of a place for recreation than business.

OkGoDoIt 6y ago

My job is the main reason I live in San Francisco. In my opinion Colorado is much more beautiful, Boulder has a lot of the advantages of living in a big city but also so many fewer disadvantages. Personally I’m not a big fan of the kind of nature of the bay area has to offer. I grew up in the Northeast and the southeast, and I miss the huge deciduous trees and the fall-time colors. The Bay Area is pretty, but doesn’t hold a candle to the beauty of Michigan or Colorado or Tahoe in my opinion. Obviously different people have different preferences, but for every person who believes the bay area is the perfect place to live regardless of their career, there’s at least another person who doesn’t particularly like it and has their own idea of a perfect place to live.

arethuza 6y ago
For what its worth, I'm not from the US but I have travelled a fair bit round the US and Colorado and Boulder were some of the few places that really appealed to me.
bosswipe 6y ago
Throwing in Tahoe kind of disproves your point because Tahoe is one of the reasons to live here, it's a very popular weekend trip.
- OkGoDoIt 6y ago
  I meant living in Tahoe. I’ve done the weekend trip from SF a few times and with the long drive, the traffic (everyone has the same idea), the cost of hotel, trying to fit everything in a couple days, etc, I find it more stressful to take a weekend trip there than I find it enjoyable. Living there would be great but calling it a perk of living in San Francisco is a bit of a stretch for me. If your criteria for a good place to live is having a beautiful place within a 4 hour drive, then a lot of the USA is included in that. I want to live in the nice, beautiful, low-stress place. But again, it seems to be a very personal preference. Maybe for some people having the ability to drive 4 hours to get somewhere amazing is a good balance to the things they love about living in San Francisco. I don’t consider it close enough to be a factor in my opinion of SF though. Edit: I’m not trying to get into an argument about how amazing or horrible the Bay Area is. I’m just saying that some people find it amazing but other people actually would prefer to live in (the suburbs of) Detroit or elsewhere. I have no idea the percent of people in each group, but I don’t think we should take for a given than if all big industry leaves the Bay Area, that it will still be as popular as it is today. Not everyone loves it that much.
  - throwaway0a5e 6y ago
    >I want to live in the nice, beautiful, low-stress place As long as whatever you consider nice is the same as whatever every other similarly paid white collar worker with a spouse and 1.75 kids considers nice you will never be able to get that. Those places always will be overprices and high stress. Look at how Boston area money has shit up Cape Cod, southern Maine and NH. NYC money has shit up all of Long Island, large parts of PA, upstate and VT. CA money has shit up Colorado so bad that CO money shits all over Utah. Chicago money shits all over Wisconsin. What you're really trying to get away from is the secondary effects of people like you (and me, and most everyone on HN). You're trying to get away from a service and tourism economy where everyone else is (somewhat rightfully) out to screw you for every dollar you're worth. Unless you have radically different tastes in what you want this will never be possible because all the other people of the same means will gravitate toward the same places.

vharuck 6y ago

>The Bay Area has amazing weather, unbelievable scenery, world-class recreation, and tons of music and culture. The weather will persist, but the rest are qualities of cities with large populations who have lots of disposable income.

microtherion 6y ago
I agree regarding music & culture. Detroit used to have awesome music, e.g. Motown Records in its heyday, and even when in decline, it was considered one of the birthplaces of techno.
- Apocryphon 6y ago
  And during the last gasp of rock at the beginning of the 21st century, Detroit brought us the White Stripes!
seattle_spring 6y ago
Unbelievable scenery and world-class recreation have nothing to do with being a "city with a large population." In fact, the presence of a large population center usually makes these things worse.

cvhashim 6y ago

> tons of music and culture High living costs and living conditions will have the starving artists that make these things you consume flock somewhere else or never move out to the Bay in the first place. Consequently the next generation of these artists won't be coming out of the bay, ironically you'll start to see more culture and art come out of places like Detroit.

RC_ITR 6y ago
I think you're conflating avant-garde with world class. Take restaurants for example - super easy to start a new inventive restaurant in Detroit (low rent, low labor costs, etc.), but it's nearly impossible to make a $500/head prix-fixe work there (and that is, for better of worse, the type of food that causes people to flock now-a-days). Even Portland sees most of it's 'starving artist' chefs decamp to NY / SF / LA once they gain a national brand.

jdmg94 6y ago

weather alone is not worth the current housing prices in California, specially considering how we're actively fucking up climate.