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You can find better references in the czech version of the wiki article https://cs.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karlův_most https://cs.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karlův_most Ba

by yread 6y ago

You can find better references in the czech version of the wiki article https://cs.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karlův_most https://cs.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karlův_most Basically, it is just a hypothesis by some astronomist. Contemporary chronicler recorded just the year that the construction was started

feralimal 6y ago
Actually, if you find a better version of that book than the one on archive.org, you can see this info on page 251. I'm just looking now... Not sure why this isn't found in archive.org's search.
- feralimal 6y ago
  In the book, it says: "Charles BridgeAmong the best-known architectural features of Prague is Charles Bridge (Karl¿v most). Known as PragueBridge until 1870, it spans the Vltava River and the Kampa Island between the Lesser Town and the OldTown. It is one of the oldest stone bridges in Europe and the second oldest in the republic (the oldest inPísek, Bohemia, was built in the thirteenth century).The first bridge crossing the Vltava in Prague was wooden anddated from the tenth century. The Judith stone bridge, built 1158–1160, spanned the river until a disastrous floodwashed it away in 1342. Charles IV commissioned Petr Parlérˇ to erect a new bridge; being somewhat superstitious,the king broke ground for the bridge in 1357 on 9 July at 5:31 A.M., thus creating a date and time that, if given com-pletely in numbers, is a perfect palindrome: 1–3–5–7–9–7–5–3–1. The sandstone bridge, stretching 516 meters with sixteen arches, was completed in 1402.Thirty statues adorn thebridge (the originals for most are in the Lapidarium of the National Museum). In 1683 Charles Bridge received itsfirst baroque sculpture, that of St. John Nepomuk, the work of Matthias Rauchmüller and Jan Brokoff. The bronzerelief at the base of the statue depicts the false legend that Jan Nepomuk would not tell Václav IV the secrets of thequeen’s confession, so Václav IV had him cast into the Vltava from the bridge (a bronze cross in the bridge parapetmarks the alleged spot). Other baroque masters who sculpted works for the bridge included Ferdinand MaximiliánBrokoff, Michal Josef Brokoff, and Matyá≥Bernard Braun. In the classical era, Josef Max, Emanuel Max, and otherssculpted several statues. Karel Dvorˇák completed the most recent statue, that of the missionaries Cyril and Method-ius, in 1938. On the Lesser Town side of the bridge are two towers.The first is a remnant of the Judith Bridge that was rebuiltin 1591. The taller Gothic tower was completed in 1464, and a Gothic gateway links the two towers. On the OldTown side of the bridge stands a single Gothic tower decorated with saints, the builders, and skillfully executed rep-resentations of Charles IV and his son,Václav IV. Also embellishing the tower are the coats of arms of the Bohemiankingdom.The roof is the design of Josef Mocker from the late nineteenth century. A portion of the Old Town Towerfacade and the bridge was damaged during a Swedish bombardment in 1648." Ok - so now, I can see where the wiki claim is from. But, where is this source in the history book from? My problem is that this is presented as true, but I want to know where the sources are. The book "EASTERN EUROPE" by RICHARD FRUCHT, was written in 2005. Obviously we are not dealing with a primary or secondary source. But what is the source Frucht is using? Is it just a story Frucht or someone else made up? We don't know.
feralimal 6y ago
My Czech is not the best, if I'm honest... So, your reading is that its a hyposthesis by some astronomer. And that someone chronicled the year construction started. If you are able to provide sources for those, that would be interesting! Cheers
- yread 6y ago
  The reference is this article https://www.academia.edu/3093773/Založení_Karlova_mostu_a_kosmologická_symbolika_Staroměstské_mostecké_věže_in_Staletá_Praha_Sborník_Pražského_střediska_Státní_památkové_péče_a_ochrany_přírody_9_Praha_Panorama_1979_s_197_212 https://www.academia.edu/3093773/Založení_Karlova_mostu_a_ko... (alert: scanned and turned 90 degrees, my neck hurts) On page 202 it describes founding of the bridge. The author puts it in context of gathering the remnants of St. Vitus (that Charles was obsessed about and his statue is present on one of towers at the end of the bridge) and highlights that the conjunction (opposition) of Saturn and the Sun happened on 1357, 9th day of 7th month. He further investigates whether the way Charles or people of his age would write the date is the same as ours and concludes that it is likely - arab numerals, year, day, month then time, 60-minute hours are all documented in his court. Founding of the bridge would have to include a mass so it could not take place in the afternoon, which 5:31 AM isn't. Indeed different ways of expressing time used at the time are all consistent with that - except the "old bohemian" way to express time because that would be before sunrise. If they did express it the same way as we do then at 5:31 AM the constellation of Lion (symbol of Czech kings) was in ascendent (just above horizon, important astrological place). Additionally, a sign (which was dated to 1640 but could have been a replacement of an older one) on one of the towers at the end of the bridge contains a palindrome poem (in Latin). Another reason why it could be true comes for the author from the fact that Charles and his people would have known and read Dante Alighieri's Vita nuova where similar numerological symmetry plays a major role. And the Prague Astronomical Clock contains a completely extra gear that serves no purpose but the counts of its tooth is also a palindromatic sequence.

by yread 6y ago

feralimal 6y ago

Actually, if you find a better version of that book than the one on archive.org, you can see this info on page 251. I'm just looking now... Not sure why this isn't found in archive.org's search.

feralimal 6y ago
In the book, it says: "Charles BridgeAmong the best-known architectural features of Prague is Charles Bridge (Karl¿v most). Known as PragueBridge until 1870, it spans the Vltava River and the Kampa Island between the Lesser Town and the OldTown. It is one of the oldest stone bridges in Europe and the second oldest in the republic (the oldest inPísek, Bohemia, was built in the thirteenth century).The first bridge crossing the Vltava in Prague was wooden anddated from the tenth century. The Judith stone bridge, built 1158–1160, spanned the river until a disastrous floodwashed it away in 1342. Charles IV commissioned Petr Parlérˇ to erect a new bridge; being somewhat superstitious,the king broke ground for the bridge in 1357 on 9 July at 5:31 A.M., thus creating a date and time that, if given com-pletely in numbers, is a perfect palindrome: 1–3–5–7–9–7–5–3–1. The sandstone bridge, stretching 516 meters with sixteen arches, was completed in 1402.Thirty statues adorn thebridge (the originals for most are in the Lapidarium of the National Museum). In 1683 Charles Bridge received itsfirst baroque sculpture, that of St. John Nepomuk, the work of Matthias Rauchmüller and Jan Brokoff. The bronzerelief at the base of the statue depicts the false legend that Jan Nepomuk would not tell Václav IV the secrets of thequeen’s confession, so Václav IV had him cast into the Vltava from the bridge (a bronze cross in the bridge parapetmarks the alleged spot). Other baroque masters who sculpted works for the bridge included Ferdinand MaximiliánBrokoff, Michal Josef Brokoff, and Matyá≥Bernard Braun. In the classical era, Josef Max, Emanuel Max, and otherssculpted several statues. Karel Dvorˇák completed the most recent statue, that of the missionaries Cyril and Method-ius, in 1938. On the Lesser Town side of the bridge are two towers.The first is a remnant of the Judith Bridge that was rebuiltin 1591. The taller Gothic tower was completed in 1464, and a Gothic gateway links the two towers. On the OldTown side of the bridge stands a single Gothic tower decorated with saints, the builders, and skillfully executed rep-resentations of Charles IV and his son,Václav IV. Also embellishing the tower are the coats of arms of the Bohemiankingdom.The roof is the design of Josef Mocker from the late nineteenth century. A portion of the Old Town Towerfacade and the bridge was damaged during a Swedish bombardment in 1648." Ok - so now, I can see where the wiki claim is from. But, where is this source in the history book from? My problem is that this is presented as true, but I want to know where the sources are. The book "EASTERN EUROPE" by RICHARD FRUCHT, was written in 2005. Obviously we are not dealing with a primary or secondary source. But what is the source Frucht is using? Is it just a story Frucht or someone else made up? We don't know.

feralimal 6y ago

My Czech is not the best, if I'm honest... So, your reading is that its a hyposthesis by some astronomer. And that someone chronicled the year construction started. If you are able to provide sources for those, that would be interesting! Cheers

yread 6y ago
The reference is this article https://www.academia.edu/3093773/Založení_Karlova_mostu_a_kosmologická_symbolika_Staroměstské_mostecké_věže_in_Staletá_Praha_Sborník_Pražského_střediska_Státní_památkové_péče_a_ochrany_přírody_9_Praha_Panorama_1979_s_197_212 https://www.academia.edu/3093773/Založení_Karlova_mostu_a_ko... (alert: scanned and turned 90 degrees, my neck hurts) On page 202 it describes founding of the bridge. The author puts it in context of gathering the remnants of St. Vitus (that Charles was obsessed about and his statue is present on one of towers at the end of the bridge) and highlights that the conjunction (opposition) of Saturn and the Sun happened on 1357, 9th day of 7th month. He further investigates whether the way Charles or people of his age would write the date is the same as ours and concludes that it is likely - arab numerals, year, day, month then time, 60-minute hours are all documented in his court. Founding of the bridge would have to include a mass so it could not take place in the afternoon, which 5:31 AM isn't. Indeed different ways of expressing time used at the time are all consistent with that - except the "old bohemian" way to express time because that would be before sunrise. If they did express it the same way as we do then at 5:31 AM the constellation of Lion (symbol of Czech kings) was in ascendent (just above horizon, important astrological place). Additionally, a sign (which was dated to 1640 but could have been a replacement of an older one) on one of the towers at the end of the bridge contains a palindrome poem (in Latin). Another reason why it could be true comes for the author from the fact that Charles and his people would have known and read Dante Alighieri's Vita nuova where similar numerological symmetry plays a major role. And the Prague Astronomical Clock contains a completely extra gear that serves no purpose but the counts of its tooth is also a palindromatic sequence.