5 ms·

Not high risk high reward. Not funny. Not clever. Not successful. Dumb. Sad. Deeply cruel. The generally casual way it is discussed here is not surprising.

konjin 6y ago
Because of all the fucked up things the CIA did this isn't even in the top 1e5.
himinlomax 6y ago
Arming South American deathsquads with drug money is one thing, but harming fluffy kittens ... now that's outrage time!
- HenryBemis 6y ago
  >the cat was re-sewn for a second time, and lived a long and happy life afterwards Seeing/knowing how much secret service orgs (of all countries) value human life (near-zero), I will go ahead and assume that somewhere in Moscow there is a hole with 100 dead cats.
  - Joker_vD 6y ago
    rolls the eyes By the middle 1920-ies there were quite a lot of stray cats and dogs in the Moscow (y'know, after all those events in the span of 1914-1922), and then the city management finally got means and funds to do something with it. So I assure you, there are a lot of holes with hundreds of dead cats in Moscow (and other cities too), without any secret orgs involved.
    - konjin 6y ago
      I doubt that, the cats and dogs would have been eaten.
  - MisterTea 6y ago
    > I will go ahead and assume that somewhere in Moscow there is a hole with 100 dead cats. I'm pretty sure there are a few barrels full dead cats and dogs sitting in the back of shelters all over the USA right now. Waiting for their turn through rendering plant shredder.
- smcl 6y ago
  I imagine that GP is outraged at both the CIA spilling blood and causing chaos in Central and South America and their animal cruelty. The animal cruelty is the story here though which is probably why they didn't go into the multitude of other crimes.
- MisterTea 6y ago
  whataboutism 101.
  - himinlomax 6y ago
    That's not what "whataboutism" means. For one, I neither torture cats nor salvadorians.
    - vageli 6y ago
      Whataboutism: "the technique or practice of responding to an accusation or difficult question by making a counteraccusation or raising a different issue." Seems like a textbook case actually.
      - himinlomax 6y ago
        Who's responding to an accusation? I'm mocking someone who's more concerned about cats than about humans. That makes no damn sense.
        vageli 6y ago
        Who said the parent is unconcerned about humans? Are people expected to list out all of their concerns when addressing the article at hand?
        MisterTea 6y ago
        Why even value one over the other? We both experience pain, suffering and anxiety. The only difference is the cat has no ability to consent to torture rendered by a self conscious, intelligent animal which is fully aware of what they are doing. In conclusion: You have a moral failing.
cstross 6y ago
I take it you wouldn't approve of the CIA's experiments on elephants either! In 1962 Tusko the elephant was given 297mg (yes, milligrams, not micrograms) of LSD by CIA-funded quacks who were trying to simulate "musth" in the hope that it could be used to weaponize elephants for sabotage in south-east Asia (hint: Vietnam war in progress). We now know that 297mg of LSD will kill an elephant. https://www.theguardian.com/science/2004/feb/26/research.science https://www.theguardian.com/science/2004/feb/26/research.sci... In case you think I'm making this up, the original paper was published in Science: West, LJ; Pierce, CM; Thomas, WD (7 December 1962). "Lysergic Acid Diethylamide: Its Effects on a Male Asiatic Elephant". Science. 138 (3545): 1100–3. It's online here (account needed): https://science.sciencemag.org/content/138/3545/1100 https://science.sciencemag.org/content/138/3545/1100
- milquetoastaf 6y ago
  Jolly West is an interesting fellow - and by interesting I mean, depraved. The chapters about him in CHAOS by Tom O'Neil are fascinatingly grim
- MisterTea 6y ago
  > We now know that 297mg of LSD will kill an elephant. ... along with a boat load of Thorazine followed by a tranquilizer.
- lostgame 6y ago
  >> We now know that 297mg of LSD will kill an elephant. The facepalm I'm having at the moment would make Patrick Stewart jealous. I misread that as μg and had to do a double-take. That's...that's like several entire music festival's worth of LSD.
  - cstross 6y ago
    Yep. When I called the CIA researchers "quacks" I did so for a reason: when tox testing, it is customary to start with a minimal dose then increase it progressively until it exhibits a measurable effect, not start with a huge overdose! 297mg is one thousand times the typical dose sold for black market acid in the mid-1960s, per wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysergic_acid_diethylamide#Dosage https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysergic_acid_diethylamide#Dos... (As an elephant weighs on the order of 20-50 times as much as a human, administering a thousand times a typical human dose was ... inadvisable to say the least.)
chuckSu 6y ago
It is kinda funny.

konjin 6y ago

Because of all the fucked up things the CIA did this isn't even in the top 1e5.

himinlomax 6y ago

Arming South American deathsquads with drug money is one thing, but harming fluffy kittens ... now that's outrage time!

HenryBemis 6y ago
>the cat was re-sewn for a second time, and lived a long and happy life afterwards Seeing/knowing how much secret service orgs (of all countries) value human life (near-zero), I will go ahead and assume that somewhere in Moscow there is a hole with 100 dead cats.
- Joker_vD 6y ago
  rolls the eyes By the middle 1920-ies there were quite a lot of stray cats and dogs in the Moscow (y'know, after all those events in the span of 1914-1922), and then the city management finally got means and funds to do something with it. So I assure you, there are a lot of holes with hundreds of dead cats in Moscow (and other cities too), without any secret orgs involved.
  - konjin 6y ago
    I doubt that, the cats and dogs would have been eaten.
- MisterTea 6y ago
  > I will go ahead and assume that somewhere in Moscow there is a hole with 100 dead cats. I'm pretty sure there are a few barrels full dead cats and dogs sitting in the back of shelters all over the USA right now. Waiting for their turn through rendering plant shredder.
smcl 6y ago
I imagine that GP is outraged at both the CIA spilling blood and causing chaos in Central and South America and their animal cruelty. The animal cruelty is the story here though which is probably why they didn't go into the multitude of other crimes.
MisterTea 6y ago
whataboutism 101.
- himinlomax 6y ago
  That's not what "whataboutism" means. For one, I neither torture cats nor salvadorians.
  - vageli 6y ago
    Whataboutism: "the technique or practice of responding to an accusation or difficult question by making a counteraccusation or raising a different issue." Seems like a textbook case actually.
    - himinlomax 6y ago
      Who's responding to an accusation? I'm mocking someone who's more concerned about cats than about humans. That makes no damn sense.
      - vageli 6y ago
        Who said the parent is unconcerned about humans? Are people expected to list out all of their concerns when addressing the article at hand?
      - MisterTea 6y ago
        Why even value one over the other? We both experience pain, suffering and anxiety. The only difference is the cat has no ability to consent to torture rendered by a self conscious, intelligent animal which is fully aware of what they are doing. In conclusion: You have a moral failing.

cstross 6y ago

I take it you wouldn't approve of the CIA's experiments on elephants either! In 1962 Tusko the elephant was given 297mg (yes, milligrams, not micrograms) of LSD by CIA-funded quacks who were trying to simulate "musth" in the hope that it could be used to weaponize elephants for sabotage in south-east Asia (hint: Vietnam war in progress). We now know that 297mg of LSD will kill an elephant. https://www.theguardian.com/science/2004/feb/26/research.science https://www.theguardian.com/science/2004/feb/26/research.sci... In case you think I'm making this up, the original paper was published in Science: West, LJ; Pierce, CM; Thomas, WD (7 December 1962). "Lysergic Acid Diethylamide: Its Effects on a Male Asiatic Elephant". Science. 138 (3545): 1100–3. It's online here (account needed): https://science.sciencemag.org/content/138/3545/1100 https://science.sciencemag.org/content/138/3545/1100

milquetoastaf 6y ago
Jolly West is an interesting fellow - and by interesting I mean, depraved. The chapters about him in CHAOS by Tom O'Neil are fascinatingly grim
MisterTea 6y ago
> We now know that 297mg of LSD will kill an elephant. ... along with a boat load of Thorazine followed by a tranquilizer.
lostgame 6y ago
>> We now know that 297mg of LSD will kill an elephant. The facepalm I'm having at the moment would make Patrick Stewart jealous. I misread that as μg and had to do a double-take. That's...that's like several entire music festival's worth of LSD.
- cstross 6y ago
  Yep. When I called the CIA researchers "quacks" I did so for a reason: when tox testing, it is customary to start with a minimal dose then increase it progressively until it exhibits a measurable effect, not start with a huge overdose! 297mg is one thousand times the typical dose sold for black market acid in the mid-1960s, per wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysergic_acid_diethylamide#Dosage https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysergic_acid_diethylamide#Dos... (As an elephant weighs on the order of 20-50 times as much as a human, administering a thousand times a typical human dose was ... inadvisable to say the least.)

chuckSu 6y ago

It is kinda funny.