4 ms·

I'm sure there's some deep context to that - could you share/link? Claiming that kind of experience juxtaposed with an article like this screams of the importan

I'm sure there's some deep context to that - could you share/link? Claiming that kind of experience juxtaposed with an article like this screams of the importance of us drawing our own conclusions rather than taking either of your words for it.

jrockway 15y ago
I forget. I was giving him patches for HTML::Tidy, then some whining occurred on IRC, then he "banned" me. Wish I still had the logs, but it was like 4 years ago.
- urbanjunkie 15y ago
  Either be prepared to give us some verifiable context or just don't post a comment like this.
  - erez 15y ago
    a: he just did, and b: let the users here decide what's suitable or unsuitable to comment here. This is exactly what Andy Lester is talking about.
    - urbanjunkie 15y ago
      a. Is "I forget [snip] wish I still had the logs" verifiable context? b. I'm a user, and I don't think his comment was suitable. How else can users express whether or not they find a comment suitable unless they say so? In a nutshell, I don't think people should fling around implicit accusations of hypocrisy without some form of evidence that can be verified.
      - erez 15y ago
        >How else can users express whether or not they find a comment suitable unless they say so? Isn't that what the upvote-downvote system is for?
  - jrockway 15y ago
    Log found! The context was my asking "why didn't The Perl Foundation get any Google SoC projects?" I then implied that they don't do a whole lot, because I checked their IRS filings and noticed that they had several hundred thousand dollars sitting in a checking account. Why not put it in a savings account? We then get to being banned from contributing to HTML::Tidy: 22:48 <@jrockway> fine, i will happily mentor someone in an area i am familar with 22:48 <@jrockway> i have no problem with that at all 22:48 <@jrockway> next year. 22:48 <@Andy> That doesn't do much good now. 22:48 <@jrockway> what can i do this year? 22:48 <@Andy> Well, for one you can quit denigrating TPF about how useless it is. 22:49 <@jrockway> no, i can't do that 22:49 <@jrockway> what's something real i can do 22:49 <@Andy> I'm sorry to hear that you can't do that. 22:49 <@Andy> because I think that's pretty much a requirement to help out. 22:49 <@jrockway> no, it's not 22:49 <@Andy> Nobody wants help from someone who's complaining about things. 22:49 <@jrockway> you should accept help even if people don't like you (not you personally, i mean the TPF) 22:49 <@jrockway> fine 22:49 <@jrockway> i will continue to whine then 22:50 <@jrockway> that's good for everyone 22:50 <@Andy> I have no doubt about that. 22:50 * jrockway goes to work on perl projects 22:50 <@elliot> :/ 22:50 <@Andy> Not HTML::Tidy, though. 22:50 <@jrockway> "THATS MINE DON'T TOUCH IT" 22:50 <@jrockway> so constructive 22:51 <@Andy> No, I just don't need help from someone who bashes and denigrates. 22:51 <@jrockway> that's childish, but whatever 22:53 <@Andy> Not sure how choosing to decide who to work with is childish. 22:53 <@jrockway> meritocracy 22:54 <@jrockway> i accept patches / comments from anyone 22:54 <@jrockway> if the code is good, i could care less who gives it to me 22:54 <@Andy> Open source is about more than code. 22:54 <@jrockway> to you 22:55 <@hobbs> actually its motto is "shut up and show us the code" 22:55 <@jrockway> to me it is about code and solving problems 22:55 <@jrockway> hobbs++ 22:55 <@Andy> Not all problems are solved through code. 22:56 <@jrockway> to be honest i haven't run into anyone that i have personal problems with 22:56 <@jrockway> and mst is often not very nice to me 22:56 <@chargrill> well, mst is often a jerk to a lot of people. 22:56 <@jrockway> i get over it, he's a good programmer 22:56 <@jrockway> he says the same about me 22:56 <@Andy> jrockway: There are plenty of people you have personal problems with. 22:56 <@jrockway> i don't like that implication 22:56 <@Andy> OK. 22:57 <@jrockway> i have no problems with you, i have a problem with TPF 22:57 <@jrockway> i am not the only one 22:57 <@Andy> I wasn't talking about me. 22:58 <@jrockway> do we really need to focus on "who likes who" 22:59 <@jrockway> i mean, there's myspace for that 22:59 <@Andy> It's a key part of open source. 22:59 <@Andy> And I'd ask you to consider that. 23:01 <@jrockway> so what's the resolution to this? 23:01 <@jrockway> i still dislike TPF, and you have one fewer developer on HTML::Tidy? 23:01 <@jrockway> that is always good 23:01 <@jrockway> big win for everyone Incidentally, a few people created a new TPF-like entity. So I must have not been the only person in the world that didn't think they were amazingly effective or transparent.

jrockway 15y ago

I forget. I was giving him patches for HTML::Tidy, then some whining occurred on IRC, then he "banned" me. Wish I still had the logs, but it was like 4 years ago.

urbanjunkie 15y ago
Either be prepared to give us some verifiable context or just don't post a comment like this.
- erez 15y ago
  a: he just did, and b: let the users here decide what's suitable or unsuitable to comment here. This is exactly what Andy Lester is talking about.
  - urbanjunkie 15y ago
    a. Is "I forget [snip] wish I still had the logs" verifiable context? b. I'm a user, and I don't think his comment was suitable. How else can users express whether or not they find a comment suitable unless they say so? In a nutshell, I don't think people should fling around implicit accusations of hypocrisy without some form of evidence that can be verified.
    - erez 15y ago
      >How else can users express whether or not they find a comment suitable unless they say so? Isn't that what the upvote-downvote system is for?
- jrockway 15y ago
  Log found! The context was my asking "why didn't The Perl Foundation get any Google SoC projects?" I then implied that they don't do a whole lot, because I checked their IRS filings and noticed that they had several hundred thousand dollars sitting in a checking account. Why not put it in a savings account? We then get to being banned from contributing to HTML::Tidy: 22:48 <@jrockway> fine, i will happily mentor someone in an area i am familar with 22:48 <@jrockway> i have no problem with that at all 22:48 <@jrockway> next year. 22:48 <@Andy> That doesn't do much good now. 22:48 <@jrockway> what can i do this year? 22:48 <@Andy> Well, for one you can quit denigrating TPF about how useless it is. 22:49 <@jrockway> no, i can't do that 22:49 <@jrockway> what's something real i can do 22:49 <@Andy> I'm sorry to hear that you can't do that. 22:49 <@Andy> because I think that's pretty much a requirement to help out. 22:49 <@jrockway> no, it's not 22:49 <@Andy> Nobody wants help from someone who's complaining about things. 22:49 <@jrockway> you should accept help even if people don't like you (not you personally, i mean the TPF) 22:49 <@jrockway> fine 22:49 <@jrockway> i will continue to whine then 22:50 <@jrockway> that's good for everyone 22:50 <@Andy> I have no doubt about that. 22:50 * jrockway goes to work on perl projects 22:50 <@elliot> :/ 22:50 <@Andy> Not HTML::Tidy, though. 22:50 <@jrockway> "THATS MINE DON'T TOUCH IT" 22:50 <@jrockway> so constructive 22:51 <@Andy> No, I just don't need help from someone who bashes and denigrates. 22:51 <@jrockway> that's childish, but whatever 22:53 <@Andy> Not sure how choosing to decide who to work with is childish. 22:53 <@jrockway> meritocracy 22:54 <@jrockway> i accept patches / comments from anyone 22:54 <@jrockway> if the code is good, i could care less who gives it to me 22:54 <@Andy> Open source is about more than code. 22:54 <@jrockway> to you 22:55 <@hobbs> actually its motto is "shut up and show us the code" 22:55 <@jrockway> to me it is about code and solving problems 22:55 <@jrockway> hobbs++ 22:55 <@Andy> Not all problems are solved through code. 22:56 <@jrockway> to be honest i haven't run into anyone that i have personal problems with 22:56 <@jrockway> and mst is often not very nice to me 22:56 <@chargrill> well, mst is often a jerk to a lot of people. 22:56 <@jrockway> i get over it, he's a good programmer 22:56 <@jrockway> he says the same about me 22:56 <@Andy> jrockway: There are plenty of people you have personal problems with. 22:56 <@jrockway> i don't like that implication 22:56 <@Andy> OK. 22:57 <@jrockway> i have no problems with you, i have a problem with TPF 22:57 <@jrockway> i am not the only one 22:57 <@Andy> I wasn't talking about me. 22:58 <@jrockway> do we really need to focus on "who likes who" 22:59 <@jrockway> i mean, there's myspace for that 22:59 <@Andy> It's a key part of open source. 22:59 <@Andy> And I'd ask you to consider that. 23:01 <@jrockway> so what's the resolution to this? 23:01 <@jrockway> i still dislike TPF, and you have one fewer developer on HTML::Tidy? 23:01 <@jrockway> that is always good 23:01 <@jrockway> big win for everyone Incidentally, a few people created a new TPF-like entity. So I must have not been the only person in the world that didn't think they were amazingly effective or transparent.