4 ms·

> It's also worth noting how many of the cancellations have been shows with women and people of color prominently behind the scenes or starring. "One Day at a T

by crowf 6y ago

> It's also worth noting how many of the cancellations have been shows with women and people of color prominently behind the scenes or starring. "One Day at a Time," "Tuca and Bertie," "Glow," "I Am Not Okay with This," and "Everything Sucks" are just a few examples of canceled shows with both diverse characters and representation behind the lens. Maybe that has something to do with it. There is a common meme "manga, anime, Netflix adaption". The first two show the main character looking as designed, and the last show a black woman. It ends up, if you optimize for showing every race and gender rather than entertainment, I can see why the show would be cancelled.

treeman79 6y ago
Some Netflix shows are over the top with political correctness. Dragon Prince is one example. Cute show, but very in your face. Old 80s sitcom Dinosaurs, ran into the same problem. Later episodes often made you feel bad. Not the best for a comedy show. You can agree with a stance, but you don’t always want it shoved down your throat. Oh look every cast member is a different race/ gender/ orientation. Oh great, but is the show any good?
jacobion 6y ago
I don't fully understand this. Suppose that you remake say, Batman, with Batman as a black woman instead of a white man. Even assume that there's some nefarious political agenda forcing that decision. How does that make the show less entertaining? It seems like how good the show is would be orthogonal to that choice. And it doesn't take any more effort to have a black woman star than a white man, so it's not like that choice reduces the energy they can put into making the show good. On the other hand, if quite a few people just prefer to watch the version with a white man, that seems like it would correlate to the shows being cancelled, independently of how entertaining they are..
- xiphias2 6y ago
  I generally don't care whether a show stars women or men, but the stories generally get more boring in subsequent seasons of a show when it gets more and more PC. Supergirl started as a nice show that was promoting female power, but at the 4th-5th season transgender and black women started to appear just becuase they are transgender and black, and men characters got dropped out of the show just because they are men even though they were very good team companions to supergirl. Also for me it's boring to hear how much women don't need men instead of seeing an interesting story. The other problem with subsequent seasons with lots of PC speech is that viewer counts drop because of the boring story line, and then of course the series gets cancelled.
- klmadfejno 6y ago
  As someone far left of the mainstream political spectrum, there have been more than a few times when I was annoyed by what felt like pandering to "liberal" and pc ideas in netflix shows. Overly overt, unnecessary, "tell me don't show me" themes about how women are strong or whatever. Or a villain whose primary purpose is to make you think of Trump. That space force comedy with Steve Carell comes to mind I don't think it's a political agenda. I think a sizeable portion of people just like seeing this stuff that affirms their beliefs or gives them an example to point to. Conservative leaning stuff does it too, and it's even more annoying when you disagree with its themes. I recall Logan Lucky (movie) was an especially aggravating example of this on the conservative side.
  - jacobion 6y ago
    I somewhat agree with you, but I also think this is different from complaining about the representation of women or black people. Historically most superheroes have been white men. If all contemporary superhero shows had 50% women heroes and 30% non white, it would seem dissonant as fuck, but it wouldn't even remotely be evidence of a "pro-diversity bias".
    - klmadfejno 6y ago
      Yeah that's fair. The gender/race swapping is sort of a different thing I guess. By all means, diversity is good, but at the same time, I kind of rolled my eyes when seeing "Enola Holmes" show up on netflix. It's Sherlock Holmes, but a girl! Well technically his sister, but its more or less the same. Maybe its good, but I'm hesitant to watch something that's main thesis seems to be "Girls can be good detectives like Sherlock too". I don't want that. I want a story about a competent female detective that just does things her own way. Say, idk, Jessica Jones. It's the difference between making a film about black Peter Parker vs. (black) Miles Morales for spider man. If they go for Miles, great, sounds like a good start. If they go for the former, you really have to wonder why, and how big of a deal its going to be. Being talked down to with drudgingly obvious and childishly simple messages about racial equality is annoying. It's so, so much better to demonstrate equality by having competent outcomes from a diverse cast.
magicalhippo 6y ago
This is a huge turnoff for me. I enjoyed "The OA" and "Snowpiercer", I really enjoyed "Devs" and "Watchmen". I don't mind female characters. I don't mind non-white characters and I don't mind non-straight characters. But I get really annoyed when they seemingly shove those things in my face just because "yay diversity!". Have the main character be gay or black or whatever, but if it's not relevant to the story, just treat it like a matter of fact and have them act like real people.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
jiscariot 6y ago
I also think that the sheer volume of new series Netflix premiers can't draw from the best or most experienced talent pool. To me, the Netflix model is hire a 2nd/3rd writer or associate producer from a famous/well-respected TV series or film, give them their own show, and see if it sticks.

by crowf 6y ago

treeman79 6y ago

Some Netflix shows are over the top with political correctness. Dragon Prince is one example. Cute show, but very in your face. Old 80s sitcom Dinosaurs, ran into the same problem. Later episodes often made you feel bad. Not the best for a comedy show. You can agree with a stance, but you don’t always want it shoved down your throat. Oh look every cast member is a different race/ gender/ orientation. Oh great, but is the show any good?

jacobion 6y ago

I don't fully understand this. Suppose that you remake say, Batman, with Batman as a black woman instead of a white man. Even assume that there's some nefarious political agenda forcing that decision. How does that make the show less entertaining? It seems like how good the show is would be orthogonal to that choice. And it doesn't take any more effort to have a black woman star than a white man, so it's not like that choice reduces the energy they can put into making the show good. On the other hand, if quite a few people just prefer to watch the version with a white man, that seems like it would correlate to the shows being cancelled, independently of how entertaining they are..

xiphias2 6y ago
I generally don't care whether a show stars women or men, but the stories generally get more boring in subsequent seasons of a show when it gets more and more PC. Supergirl started as a nice show that was promoting female power, but at the 4th-5th season transgender and black women started to appear just becuase they are transgender and black, and men characters got dropped out of the show just because they are men even though they were very good team companions to supergirl. Also for me it's boring to hear how much women don't need men instead of seeing an interesting story. The other problem with subsequent seasons with lots of PC speech is that viewer counts drop because of the boring story line, and then of course the series gets cancelled.
klmadfejno 6y ago
As someone far left of the mainstream political spectrum, there have been more than a few times when I was annoyed by what felt like pandering to "liberal" and pc ideas in netflix shows. Overly overt, unnecessary, "tell me don't show me" themes about how women are strong or whatever. Or a villain whose primary purpose is to make you think of Trump. That space force comedy with Steve Carell comes to mind I don't think it's a political agenda. I think a sizeable portion of people just like seeing this stuff that affirms their beliefs or gives them an example to point to. Conservative leaning stuff does it too, and it's even more annoying when you disagree with its themes. I recall Logan Lucky (movie) was an especially aggravating example of this on the conservative side.
- jacobion 6y ago
  I somewhat agree with you, but I also think this is different from complaining about the representation of women or black people. Historically most superheroes have been white men. If all contemporary superhero shows had 50% women heroes and 30% non white, it would seem dissonant as fuck, but it wouldn't even remotely be evidence of a "pro-diversity bias".
  - klmadfejno 6y ago
    Yeah that's fair. The gender/race swapping is sort of a different thing I guess. By all means, diversity is good, but at the same time, I kind of rolled my eyes when seeing "Enola Holmes" show up on netflix. It's Sherlock Holmes, but a girl! Well technically his sister, but its more or less the same. Maybe its good, but I'm hesitant to watch something that's main thesis seems to be "Girls can be good detectives like Sherlock too". I don't want that. I want a story about a competent female detective that just does things her own way. Say, idk, Jessica Jones. It's the difference between making a film about black Peter Parker vs. (black) Miles Morales for spider man. If they go for Miles, great, sounds like a good start. If they go for the former, you really have to wonder why, and how big of a deal its going to be. Being talked down to with drudgingly obvious and childishly simple messages about racial equality is annoying. It's so, so much better to demonstrate equality by having competent outcomes from a diverse cast.

magicalhippo 6y ago

This is a huge turnoff for me. I enjoyed "The OA" and "Snowpiercer", I really enjoyed "Devs" and "Watchmen". I don't mind female characters. I don't mind non-white characters and I don't mind non-straight characters. But I get really annoyed when they seemingly shove those things in my face just because "yay diversity!". Have the main character be gay or black or whatever, but if it's not relevant to the story, just treat it like a matter of fact and have them act like real people.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

jiscariot 6y ago

I also think that the sheer volume of new series Netflix premiers can't draw from the best or most experienced talent pool. To me, the Netflix model is hire a 2nd/3rd writer or associate producer from a famous/well-respected TV series or film, give them their own show, and see if it sticks.