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Wrong. Go into Settings -> Privacy -> Location Services -> Maps and toggle the setting to "Never". The full set of options are: * Never * Ask Next Time * W

Wrong. Go into Settings -> Privacy -> Location Services -> Maps and toggle the setting to "Never". The full set of options are: * Never * Ask Next Time * While Using the App * While Using the App or Widgets and there is also a toggle to turn off Precise Location so that apps only get approximate location. Go nuts with the options. I just tried it and I can use the Maps app just fine with location services set to "Never". Picking some narrow definition that fits your point isn't going to convince anyone of your grand statement. It just comes off as disingenuous.

lern_too_spel 6y ago
Disabling Apple Maps from getting your location does not stop Apple from getting your location. When any app gets your location on iOS, Apple also gets your location. Apple even gets your location if no app requests your location. This is explained clearly in the link contained in comment you replied to. Both Amazon and Google allow you to get your location without telling anybody.
- askafriend 6y ago
  Apple doesn't not get _your_ location without an app requesting it. They periodically send the location of nearby cell-towers and wifi hotspots (all public information) back to a crowdsourced database. _Your_ identity isn't associated with any of it. Apple doesn't know who you are or where your phone is. They do not store GPS coordinates. A single cell tower is nowhere near accurate enough to determine the location of the phone, etc etc. Google/Android do this too: https://qz.com/1131515/google-collects-android-users-locations-even-when-location-services-are-disabled/ https://qz.com/1131515/google-collects-android-users-locatio... You can also entirely disable location services if you're uncomfortable with this and that'd stop it. You're weaponizing people's ignorance and the complexity of the technical details.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - lern_too_spel 6y ago
    > They periodically send the location of nearby cell-towers and wifi hotspots (all public information) back to a crowdsourced database. With your GPS location. That's how they figure out the location of those devices. > _Your_ identity isn't associated with any of it. As I showed in the link you continue to ignore, an easily deanonymized identifier is associated with that data in order to prevent people from sending junk data. > Google/Android do this too: The whole point is that on Android, you can opt out. Android respects users privacy enough to even ask them if they want to opt out on initial setup. > You can also entirely disable location services if you're uncomfortable with this and that'd stop it. As I explained in the link, disabling location services means you can't get your location at all. Not so with Android. > You're weaponizing people's ignorance and the complexity of the technical details. I'm fixing your and zepto's ignorance in order to protect people's privacy against bad actors like Apple.
    - askafriend 6y ago
      > The whole point is that on Android, you can opt out. The principle of Privacy isn't the act of giving people options (Facebook uses this excuse all the time - "but users had the option! not our fault!"). The principle is designing privacy into the default way people use things. At an ecosystem level the privacy awareness level and incentive structure is clear between the big companies. Nitpicking and hyperbole isn't helping make your point like you think it is. Do you think my mom knows how to opt out of something like that on Android or if that's even possible? No. But she's IS going to be using Apple Maps by default and have a heightened level of privacy all the same. Privacy is taking care of your entire customer base and making intelligent default considerations. Not giving nerds a pane of options.
      - lern_too_spel 6y ago
        > The principle is designing privacy into the default way people use things. And Android puts it right there in device setup, allowing them tonset up their privacy preferences correctly the way people use things. > Do you think my mom knows how to opt out of something like that on Android or if that's even possible? If she uses Android, she would. It asks her right there in setup. Do you think your mom knows that Apple tracks every location she has ever been, and she can't make them stop? Even you don't know it, and you're arguably tech literate. The correct way to handle privacy is giving users the choice between usability and privacy. Android does this correctly. Google's Android devices default to usable, which gives you services that are actually useful unlike the iOS apps that are missing functionality, and allows the user to install apps that are actually private and set them as default if they prefer. Other Android distributions default to the other side. iOS is worse both for people who value functionality and for people who value privacy because it gives you defaults that are neither private nor usable that you cannot change.

lern_too_spel 6y ago

Disabling Apple Maps from getting your location does not stop Apple from getting your location. When any app gets your location on iOS, Apple also gets your location. Apple even gets your location if no app requests your location. This is explained clearly in the link contained in comment you replied to. Both Amazon and Google allow you to get your location without telling anybody.

askafriend 6y ago
Apple doesn't not get _your_ location without an app requesting it. They periodically send the location of nearby cell-towers and wifi hotspots (all public information) back to a crowdsourced database. _Your_ identity isn't associated with any of it. Apple doesn't know who you are or where your phone is. They do not store GPS coordinates. A single cell tower is nowhere near accurate enough to determine the location of the phone, etc etc. Google/Android do this too: https://qz.com/1131515/google-collects-android-users-locations-even-when-location-services-are-disabled/ https://qz.com/1131515/google-collects-android-users-locatio... You can also entirely disable location services if you're uncomfortable with this and that'd stop it. You're weaponizing people's ignorance and the complexity of the technical details.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- lern_too_spel 6y ago
  > They periodically send the location of nearby cell-towers and wifi hotspots (all public information) back to a crowdsourced database. With your GPS location. That's how they figure out the location of those devices. > _Your_ identity isn't associated with any of it. As I showed in the link you continue to ignore, an easily deanonymized identifier is associated with that data in order to prevent people from sending junk data. > Google/Android do this too: The whole point is that on Android, you can opt out. Android respects users privacy enough to even ask them if they want to opt out on initial setup. > You can also entirely disable location services if you're uncomfortable with this and that'd stop it. As I explained in the link, disabling location services means you can't get your location at all. Not so with Android. > You're weaponizing people's ignorance and the complexity of the technical details. I'm fixing your and zepto's ignorance in order to protect people's privacy against bad actors like Apple.
  - askafriend 6y ago
    > The whole point is that on Android, you can opt out. The principle of Privacy isn't the act of giving people options (Facebook uses this excuse all the time - "but users had the option! not our fault!"). The principle is designing privacy into the default way people use things. At an ecosystem level the privacy awareness level and incentive structure is clear between the big companies. Nitpicking and hyperbole isn't helping make your point like you think it is. Do you think my mom knows how to opt out of something like that on Android or if that's even possible? No. But she's IS going to be using Apple Maps by default and have a heightened level of privacy all the same. Privacy is taking care of your entire customer base and making intelligent default considerations. Not giving nerds a pane of options.
    - lern_too_spel 6y ago
      > The principle is designing privacy into the default way people use things. And Android puts it right there in device setup, allowing them tonset up their privacy preferences correctly the way people use things. > Do you think my mom knows how to opt out of something like that on Android or if that's even possible? If she uses Android, she would. It asks her right there in setup. Do you think your mom knows that Apple tracks every location she has ever been, and she can't make them stop? Even you don't know it, and you're arguably tech literate. The correct way to handle privacy is giving users the choice between usability and privacy. Android does this correctly. Google's Android devices default to usable, which gives you services that are actually useful unlike the iOS apps that are missing functionality, and allows the user to install apps that are actually private and set them as default if they prefer. Other Android distributions default to the other side. iOS is worse both for people who value functionality and for people who value privacy because it gives you defaults that are neither private nor usable that you cannot change.