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I generally agree that there is nothing new under the sun. But I also think history doesn't repeat, it rhymes. > When to mainframes kind of suck? Well when you
by jacques_chester 6y ago
I generally agree that there is nothing new under the sun. But I also think history doesn't repeat, it rhymes.
> When to mainframes kind of suck? Well when you don't know whether or not you want to use them. ... Ending up, nearly exactly back where they started except that now one company owns a mainframe and dozens of companies use it to run their bits of code.
I think this reveals that there is an economic distinction between mainframes and serverless, along two fronts: size of commitment and economies of scale. Mainframe time could be extremely precisely subdivided when billing users, but the capital cost of getting to the first kilosecond was extremely high. In serverless settings the capital cost for the first unit of consumption is experienced as zero by everyone except the vendor.
(Yes, IBM runs mainframes-as-a-service, but they don't do it on the cheap).
The second difference is that the hyperscalers enjoy economies of scale and scope that no other organizations can match, including mainframe operations. If IBM is choosing between two different parts for a mainframe, they can pick the more expensive part and foist most of the cost onto their buyers, for whom there is little alternative. Meanwhile, for the hyperscalers, customers are much more price sensitive. More expense falls to their bottom line. But because they operate at such high scale, even tiny improvements are rational to pursue.
Similarly, economies of scope come from the fact that they can pool much larger amounts of variance, which makes their workloads more predictable overall than any smaller organisation can achieve. This is just the central limit theorem mercilessly steamrolling noise into smooth, predictable shapes.
But at least no punched cards.
- ChuckMcM 6y agoI really like this observation as well, especially the "cost to first kCs" which, for me, is the one differentiator. One of the things that amazed people was the Blekko, the search engine company, operated its own clusters in a data center rather than using AWS. We got a lot of side-eye for that but the numbers were pretty stunning. For our app, the cost of running that data center was about $120K/month, on Amazon (or IBM's cloud) that cost was at least $1.2M/month so 10x higher. What was even more of a pain that getting all the machines in the same racks so that they didn't share "east west" bandwidth with other racks in the data center was a huge ask for these folks, the proposed solution of over provisioning, made it just that much more expensive.
- jacques_chester 6y agoFrom an outside view it seems like AWS has definitely arbitraged costs over time to collect a lot of money. Raw capacity that costs them $1 today costs them $0.80 next year, but they still sell it at the price they chose to cover the $1. Having said that, there will be someone sprinting breathlessly into the thread to tell me that AWS has lowered prices on X a dozen times and on Y fourteen times and so on. But these decisions are made intermittently, by humans with bonus schemes, and AWS is harvesting the surplus in the meantime. It feels from the outside as if retail Amazon pays serious, ongoing attention to selling at the minimum possible price, but AWS just doesn't feel the same pressure to do so.