11 ms·

Is the point of Wine not to avoid giving Microsoft money?

cheph 6y ago
I think the point of wine is to have a Windows "runtime" that is open source and works on linux. But I would gladly pay Microsoft to have a wine like thing that supports a broader range of software better, because I prefer Linux to Windows.
- giancarlostoro 6y ago
  I dont mind Windows but being able to simply run Windows apps in a consistent way on Linux would really make my life much easier. The only downside would be the driver situation still sucks on Linux depending on GPU or other peripheral hardware but thats another fight for another day. Hell even being able to run the official Office binary on Linux would be great, course its been a rumor that might happen but theres plenty of software targetting Win32 that is useful.
romanovcode 6y ago
Not anymore. Anyone can install Windows for free (You will have the watermark). AFAIK main revenue for MS is Azure and Office360, not Windows.
- richrichardsson 6y ago
  I would imagine they make a fair chunk of change from OEM Windows licenses?
- acdha 6y ago
  If you were right this wouldn’t be a store page: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/b/windows https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/b/windows Windows 10 Home starts at $130, Pro is $200, and the business licenses start at $300. Given how much of Windows market share comes from business use, it’d be surprising they weren’t making a lot of money there. Since they’re a public company it’s easy to confirm that, yes, selling the most popular operating system in the world is profitable: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/Investor/earnings/FY-2020-Q2/ https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/Investor/earnings/FY-2020-Q2...
  - mlvljr 6y ago
    He is right though, watermarked w10 has no time limit, and comes with what seems only a few limitations, like inability to customize the taskbar location, for example.
- Siira 6y ago
  This was pretty much always true. I remember the old versions just needed a serial. A single serial number that could be used any number of times worked just fine. Here in Iran, retailers sold Windows CDs with the same serial number printed on the covers. Even when Windows detected that the license was fake, it basically didn't do anything. Some occasional messaging and a black background was the worst of it. I figure Microsoft understood that pressure on not-rich home users would just beef up its competition.
- xodice 6y ago
  Non-activated Windows is limited. You cannot even enter the appearance features in the settings application when in such a state. You can use it, sure. But between the watermark that is always on top and lack of being able to customize the OS I wouldn't want to use "free windows".
jen20 6y ago
My use for it is to run the occasional app that requires Windows without accepting a EULA which permits spyware on my machine.
johannes1234321 6y ago
They are strict about their distance to Microsoft to avoid copyright law cases. They want to make sure it is a blackbox reimplementation and no internal knowledge came in. Aside from that they are a an open source project, working on a open/libre alternative. Some people in the project certainly have issues with Microsoft, others don't.
TheRealDunkirk 6y ago
Wine is the inverse effort of WSL. Both are trying to integrate the best of the other operating system. WSL -> Give Windows users a good modern web app development experience. Wine -> Give Linux users Office and games. To that end, both have their measure of success, and shortcomings. As someone who ran Linux on the desktop for 19 years, I tried every incarnation of Wine I could get my hands on. In the end, I just always kept a Windows partition for playing games.
- Zhyl 6y ago
  Proton may be your saviour* *unless the games you play are online games with Anti-Cheat.
  - TheRealDunkirk 6y ago
    Given the hype, I almost want to reinstall Linux to try it out, and see what all the fuss is about. And it's funny you bring up anti-cheat, because my biggest success using Wine was Battlefield 2, which actually ran more smoothly on my machine under Linux than Windows, but then I tried to get online, and learned a harsh lesson.
    - Zhyl 6y ago
      As someone who has invested time and energy into setting up Wine, I think you will be pleasantly surprised by how painless it is to set up a Steam game with Proton. That is to say, you click 'install' as if you were installing a Native game and then when you click 'Play Game' it shows you a quick warning that Steam will be using a compatibility tool and then will boot up without any more fuss. The caveat is largely that not all games are solved by this [0], and the official Valve whitelist needs to be turned off in settings to use it for all games, but even with these it's still a marked improvement in Quality of Life and barrier to entry for running Windows games on Linux. I'd give it a go if you have time/inclination. I can recommend it as someone who is now Linux only as a result of this. [0] - www.protondb.com
    - ACS_Solver 6y ago
diffeomorphism 6y ago
No, free software is about freedom not money.

I think the point of wine is to have a Windows "runtime" that is open source and works on linux. But I would gladly pay Microsoft to have a wine like thing that supports a broader range of software better, because I prefer Linux to Windows.

giancarlostoro 6y ago
I dont mind Windows but being able to simply run Windows apps in a consistent way on Linux would really make my life much easier. The only downside would be the driver situation still sucks on Linux depending on GPU or other peripheral hardware but thats another fight for another day. Hell even being able to run the official Office binary on Linux would be great, course its been a rumor that might happen but theres plenty of software targetting Win32 that is useful.

romanovcode 6y ago

Not anymore. Anyone can install Windows for free (You will have the watermark). AFAIK main revenue for MS is Azure and Office360, not Windows.

richrichardsson 6y ago
I would imagine they make a fair chunk of change from OEM Windows licenses?
acdha 6y ago
If you were right this wouldn’t be a store page: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/b/windows https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/b/windows Windows 10 Home starts at $130, Pro is $200, and the business licenses start at $300. Given how much of Windows market share comes from business use, it’d be surprising they weren’t making a lot of money there. Since they’re a public company it’s easy to confirm that, yes, selling the most popular operating system in the world is profitable: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/Investor/earnings/FY-2020-Q2/ https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/Investor/earnings/FY-2020-Q2...
- mlvljr 6y ago
  He is right though, watermarked w10 has no time limit, and comes with what seems only a few limitations, like inability to customize the taskbar location, for example.
Siira 6y ago
This was pretty much always true. I remember the old versions just needed a serial. A single serial number that could be used any number of times worked just fine. Here in Iran, retailers sold Windows CDs with the same serial number printed on the covers. Even when Windows detected that the license was fake, it basically didn't do anything. Some occasional messaging and a black background was the worst of it. I figure Microsoft understood that pressure on not-rich home users would just beef up its competition.
xodice 6y ago
Non-activated Windows is limited. You cannot even enter the appearance features in the settings application when in such a state. You can use it, sure. But between the watermark that is always on top and lack of being able to customize the OS I wouldn't want to use "free windows".

jen20 6y ago

My use for it is to run the occasional app that requires Windows without accepting a EULA which permits spyware on my machine.

johannes1234321 6y ago

They are strict about their distance to Microsoft to avoid copyright law cases. They want to make sure it is a blackbox reimplementation and no internal knowledge came in. Aside from that they are a an open source project, working on a open/libre alternative. Some people in the project certainly have issues with Microsoft, others don't.

TheRealDunkirk 6y ago

Wine is the inverse effort of WSL. Both are trying to integrate the best of the other operating system. WSL -> Give Windows users a good modern web app development experience. Wine -> Give Linux users Office and games. To that end, both have their measure of success, and shortcomings. As someone who ran Linux on the desktop for 19 years, I tried every incarnation of Wine I could get my hands on. In the end, I just always kept a Windows partition for playing games.

Zhyl 6y ago
Proton may be your saviour* *unless the games you play are online games with Anti-Cheat.
- TheRealDunkirk 6y ago
  Given the hype, I almost want to reinstall Linux to try it out, and see what all the fuss is about. And it's funny you bring up anti-cheat, because my biggest success using Wine was Battlefield 2, which actually ran more smoothly on my machine under Linux than Windows, but then I tried to get online, and learned a harsh lesson.
  - Zhyl 6y ago
    As someone who has invested time and energy into setting up Wine, I think you will be pleasantly surprised by how painless it is to set up a Steam game with Proton. That is to say, you click 'install' as if you were installing a Native game and then when you click 'Play Game' it shows you a quick warning that Steam will be using a compatibility tool and then will boot up without any more fuss. The caveat is largely that not all games are solved by this [0], and the official Valve whitelist needs to be turned off in settings to use it for all games, but even with these it's still a marked improvement in Quality of Life and barrier to entry for running Windows games on Linux. I'd give it a go if you have time/inclination. I can recommend it as someone who is now Linux only as a result of this. [0] - www.protondb.com
  - ACS_Solver 6y ago

diffeomorphism 6y ago

No, free software is about freedom not money.