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Apple forces Telegram to Close Channels Run by Belarus Protestors
- vmception 6y agoAlthough I dont like the precedent I will definitely use this Reporting spam or harassment doesnt work on Telegram and cease and desist is hard too But knowing I can just go to Apple instead is definitely a tool
- zepto 6y agoThis is a very serious problem, and Apple’s role in it is ambiguous at best. It’s also paradoxically why we need a real open alternative and not state regulation of App stores.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
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- fsflover 6y agoDupe: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24721501 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24721501
- bmarquez 6y agoI'm not sure why this news isn't getting more traction. Another example of Apple having too much control over iOS app distribution and why sideloading should be allowed.
- zepto 6y agoProbably because it’s false. Apple didn’t ask for the channels to be closed. Just the doxing posts. That seems a lot more reasonable.
- nvrspyx 6y agoAs far as I know, they've requested Telegram to take down 3 channels. Doxing was simply what the channels were being used for. Specifically, doxing their oppressors.
- zepto 6y agoAs far as I can see they didn’t ask Telegram to take down the channels. Just the individual doxing messages. As for ‘doxing the oppressors’, three law enforcement officers were indivually targeted. Sure they are part of an oppressive system, but so are many other people.
- sthnblllII 6y agoWe must liberate the people of the world from their non-US backed oppressors so that they may be replaced with US-controlled ones like Pinochet The Shah and Saddam (until he went rogue)
- dang 6y agoYou've been breaking the site guidelines badly by using HN for ideological flamewar. We ban this sort of account, so please stop. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- sam_lowry_ 6y agoThere are channels dedicated to publishing information about members of state-run gangs, e.g. https://t.me/belarusassholes https://t.me/belarusassholes Deleting their messages means deleting the entire contents of channels.
- madaxe_again 6y agoAnd what’s the problem? They are oppressors, voluntarily working for an oppressive system. Nobody forced them to beat up old women on the street - they chose to do that. Given that there will be no legal consequences for their brutal acts, why should they not be targeted? Or do you think that we should put corporations in charge of criminal justice?
- 9HZZRfNlpR 6y agoApple will waive the rainbow flag and for the privileged SV codebros it's good enough
- dzhiurgis 6y agoYeah it seems Apple still riding closet gay wave 40 years later.
- type0 6y agoSomehow I'm not surprised since Apple likes totalitarian measures. Do they allow decentralized apps on iOS?
- BostonEnginerd 6y agoThere are a number of them - Matrix clients, SecureScuttlebutt, etc.
- CodesInChaos 6y agoI read about decentralized apps being forced to blacklist certain servers by appstore providers (I don't remember if it was Apple or Google or both).
- m-p-3 6y agoWould Mastodon count? It's federated, and you can point the client to your own instance AFAIK, unless the developer blacklisted some domain names right in the app (willingly or from Apple apps reviewer, not sure if that's a thing).
- zenexer 6y agoThe title here is incorrect, and a good portion of the article is misleading. Telegram will be restricting access to the channels on iOS, but users on other platforms will continue to be able to access them unimpeded. While this is still a terrible move by Apple, it’s an important distinction to make, as the channels do remain accessible to the majority of people.
- zenexer 6y agoI’m not sure why this is getting downvoted. Apple isn’t “forcing Telegram to close channels.” The channels won’t be closed. That doesn’t make Apple’s move any less scummy, but it’s an important distinction for participants of those communities.
- bmarquez 6y agoIt's probably being downvoted because the article literally says "Apple is requesting that Telegram shut down three channels". Durov hopes that blocking them from iOS and not other platforms will satiate Apple's demands, but it's not definite and according to him, just an assumption.
- zenexer 6y agoPer Durov in his Telegram channel: > Apple released a statement (https://www.gazeta.ru/tech/news/2020/10/09/n_15056407.shtml https://www.gazeta.ru/tech/news/2020/10/09/n_15056407.shtml) saying they didn't want us to take down the 3 channels (https://t.me/durov/135 https://t.me/durov/135) run by the Belarusian protestors, but just specific posts "disclosing personal information." He goes on to clarify that the request effectively amounts to asking that the channels be deleted, but that restricting them on iOS should be sufficient. Regardless of your take, at the moment, the following statement is false: > Apple forces Telegram to Close Channels Run by Belarus Protestors For now: 1. Apple claims that wasn't their request. 2. The channels won't be closed. 3. Telegram won't be removed from the App Store. "Apple forces Telegram to Close Channels" makes it sound as though the channels are, in fact, being closed, which isn't the case. It's one thing to call Apple out on their behavior here, but it's another matter entirely to scare users into thinking that the channels will be deleted--they won't, assuming you're not on iOS. If you're in one of those channels, statistically, you're probably not on iOS anyway.
- krimpenrik 6y agoCan't believe anyone in his right mind would still be a apple fan boy with the recent developments around Apple
- p2t2p 6y agoYep, I used to be a fanboy, was cooling off for last year or so, this news is point of no return for me.
- zepto 6y agoDoes the fact that it’s false information change anything for you? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24734026 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24734026
- p2t2p 6y agoI don't see how it's false given that the only way to do it is to restrict access to those channels on iOS. I still see no difference. "Because your app on our platform we will censor whatever people do in it"
- zepto 6y agohttps://meduza.io/en/news/2020/10/09/apple-says-it-never-asked-telegram-to-delete-belarusian-channels-for-doxing-cops-it-just-wants-specific-posts-removed https://meduza.io/en/news/2020/10/09/apple-says-it-never-ask... It’s false.
- azangru 6y agoAren't they supposedly doing better on privacy than Google/Android is?
- Dahoon 6y agoNo...
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- maxgashkov 6y agoYeah, but those channels are for effectively doxxing LEA workers in Belarus (and people affiliated with them). While sympathetic to the protest movement there I'm feeling really conflicted in regards to its contents and if channels for coordination of bullying should be accepted on any platform, whatever the reason.
- reader_mode 6y agoThat should be a decision made by Telegram not Apple.
- zepto 6y agoShould has nothing to do with it. It’s a legal issue. Telegram doesn’t have to follow the laws of Belarus, whereas Apple who has a presence there, does.
- baybal2 6y agoIt's not a legal issue, that's a moral issue.
- zepto 6y agoChoosing whether to follow the law or not is a legal issue.
- baybal2 6y agoIt's not a legal issue, it is a moral issue. An amoral law is not to be followed even if it is your life is on stake, otherwise you will turn into an unvirtuous man. In this situation, Mr Cook, a man running world's most valuable company, decided to part with virtue, and become a man without honour.
- maxgashkov 6y agoWhy not? Lawful aspect aside, Apple states the conditions in their ToS upon which the app will be accepted and will stay available in their ecosystem. It may seem unfair and counterintuitive, but I suspect that there is non-zero portion of Apple users that happily subscribe to this model. What we're discussing here has strong political flavor, but this isn't the only case of Apple censoring Telegram's content. For example, all even remotely pornographic channels have been banned in native Telegram apps on iOS for years. Somehow Durov is silent about this (probably because you can't score some cheap publicity over defense of pornography). His double standards aside: parent buying his child an iPhone is probably much happier due to this policy than not.
- flemhans 6y agoImagine how forbidden a web browser should be, then.
- lightgreen 6y agoImagine one day Safari will start blocking certain websites if owners won’t comply with Apple requests.
- p2t2p 6y agoWell, that’s the end of story of me and Apple. My next phone will be android (because there‘s nothing else mainstream enough).