5 ms·

> is incredibly heavy and so sticks to the ground This is the first time I've ever heard people saying "heavy" as a pro. Any car is heavy in a sense of staying

> is incredibly heavy and so sticks to the ground This is the first time I've ever heard people saying "heavy" as a pro. Any car is heavy in a sense of staying firmly on the ground. The rest is steering, suspension, and rubber; a tiny cheap Fiesta ST on good tires and dry tarmac handles like it's on rails. It'll go around a corner much more eagerly though, being about 60% lighter than a model 3.

modeless 6y ago
Heavy is the wrong way to describe it. What the Model 3 has is a very low center of gravity and low moment of inertia due to the low and centered battery pack.
xedeon 6y ago
Not quite. Low center of gravity is key. "In addition to its near 50/50 weight distribution, Model 3 was also designed with an extremely low polar moment of inertia, which means that its heaviest components are located closer to the car’s center of gravity. Even though Model 3 has no engine, its performance is similar to what’s described as a “mid-engine car” due to its centered battery pack (the heaviest component of the car) and the fact that Model 3’s rear motor is placed slightly in front of the rear axle rather than behind it. Not only does this architecture add to the overall agility and handling of the car, it also improves the capability of stability control by minimizing rotational kinetic energy." Source: https://www.tesla.com/blog/model-3-lowest-probability-injury-any-vehicle-ever-tested-nhtsa https://www.tesla.com/blog/model-3-lowest-probability-injury... This also has some safety benefits such as low rollover risk: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L24xzJkCGdk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L24xzJkCGdk
- thesz 6y ago
  I think that Tesla's PR department is not a right source for judgement. https://fastestlaps.com/tests/95pv46ue63rt https://fastestlaps.com/tests/95pv46ue63rt - Tesla Model 3 Performance does not win big over BMW M3.
  - xedeon 6y ago
    When it comes to track times and races. A win is a win. That is an absolute fact. https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/bgxie8/electric_beats_petrol_tesla_model_3_outguns_bmw/ https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/bgxie8/electri... It's also funny how you claim it's PR. When it's actually physics at work when it comes to low center of gravity. http://www.formula1-dictionary.net/centre_of_gravity.html http://www.formula1-dictionary.net/centre_of_gravity.html http://www.schoolphysics.co.uk/age11-14/Mechanics/Statics/text/Stability_/index.html http://www.schoolphysics.co.uk/age11-14/Mechanics/Statics/te...
    - thesz 6y ago
      The quote about "exceptional ride due to lower center of gravity and essentially middle engine design" was taken from Tesla PR in the comment I've replied to. The 0-100km/h times for M3 and Model 3 is 3.9 and 3.2 seconds respectively and, essentially, 20%. The difference in peak torque (helps in acceleration out of corners) is smaller, 550 N/m and 639 N/m, about 11%. Power (helps at high speed) difference also less - 317kW and 340kW, yet Tesla win here too. Model 3 is even slightly wider (2cm, about 1% wider), which should help in track too. And after all that, a whopping 0.1s of win. Tesla borked their very first Roadster, despite the fact that they had to provide only drivetrain to it and everything else was done by Lotus. The analysis above suggests that they are still do not get driving as opposed to drag racing.
      - xedeon 6y ago
        > "exceptional ride due to lower center of gravity and essentially middle engine design" That is a factual statement! Let me ask you this. Have you driven a decent mid-engine sports car like a Porsche 718 Boxster and a Tesla Model 3 performance? I have. They both handle quite well. >The 0-100km/h times for M3 and Model 3 is 3.9 and 3.2 seconds respectively and, essentially, 20%. The difference in peak torque (helps in acceleration out of corners) is smaller, 550 N/m and 639 N/m, about 11%. Power (helps at high speed) difference also less - 317kW and 340kW, yet Tesla win here too. Model 3 is even slightly wider (2cm, about 1% wider), which should help in track too. And after all that, a whopping 0.1s of win. Facts are facts, you can't spin it to suit your narrative. The Model 3 won while being heavier and costing significantly less is impressive. That was also prior to track mode being released and the new high performance package. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QXyEgl9rFN4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QXyEgl9rFN4 > Tesla borked their very first Roadster, despite the fact that they had to provide only drivetrain to it and everything else was done by Lotus. Do you have a background in automotive engineering? Elon Musk and the Tesla engineers said on many occasions, that the original Roadster only had about 20% original parts after they were done with the conversion. They also said that it would have been easier to start from scratch had they known the amount of hard work that had to be done. > The analysis above suggests that they are still do not get driving as opposed to drag racing. Terrible analysis. Randy Pobst (look him up) who is well respected in racing would tell you otherwise: https://youtu.be/aywleQX5lyA?t=202 https://youtu.be/aywleQX5lyA?t=202 Unplugged Performance Street Tuned Model 3 Beats McLaren F1 - Time Attack at Tsukuba Circuit https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2dustv6utY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2dustv6utY Tesla Model 3 prevails with two hill climb victories after Pikes Peak crash https://thedriven.io/2020/09/01/tesla-model-3-prevails-with-two-hill-climb-victories-after-pikes-peak-crash/ https://thedriven.io/2020/09/01/tesla-model-3-prevails-with-... Tesla Model 3 Performance Tire Rack Hot Lap https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgCf4aos0ZY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgCf4aos0ZY Randy Pobst Pikes Peak Hill Climb 2020 (Unplugged Performance Tesla Run) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvZMwiwnLVg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvZMwiwnLVg Pikes Peak Unplugged Performance Tesla Day 2 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q23I3BywBAA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q23I3BywBAA

modeless 6y ago

Heavy is the wrong way to describe it. What the Model 3 has is a very low center of gravity and low moment of inertia due to the low and centered battery pack.

xedeon 6y ago

Not quite. Low center of gravity is key. "In addition to its near 50/50 weight distribution, Model 3 was also designed with an extremely low polar moment of inertia, which means that its heaviest components are located closer to the car’s center of gravity. Even though Model 3 has no engine, its performance is similar to what’s described as a “mid-engine car” due to its centered battery pack (the heaviest component of the car) and the fact that Model 3’s rear motor is placed slightly in front of the rear axle rather than behind it. Not only does this architecture add to the overall agility and handling of the car, it also improves the capability of stability control by minimizing rotational kinetic energy." Source: https://www.tesla.com/blog/model-3-lowest-probability-injury-any-vehicle-ever-tested-nhtsa https://www.tesla.com/blog/model-3-lowest-probability-injury... This also has some safety benefits such as low rollover risk: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L24xzJkCGdk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L24xzJkCGdk

thesz 6y ago
I think that Tesla's PR department is not a right source for judgement. https://fastestlaps.com/tests/95pv46ue63rt https://fastestlaps.com/tests/95pv46ue63rt - Tesla Model 3 Performance does not win big over BMW M3.
- xedeon 6y ago
  When it comes to track times and races. A win is a win. That is an absolute fact. https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/bgxie8/electric_beats_petrol_tesla_model_3_outguns_bmw/ https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/bgxie8/electri... It's also funny how you claim it's PR. When it's actually physics at work when it comes to low center of gravity. http://www.formula1-dictionary.net/centre_of_gravity.html http://www.formula1-dictionary.net/centre_of_gravity.html http://www.schoolphysics.co.uk/age11-14/Mechanics/Statics/text/Stability_/index.html http://www.schoolphysics.co.uk/age11-14/Mechanics/Statics/te...
  - thesz 6y ago
    The quote about "exceptional ride due to lower center of gravity and essentially middle engine design" was taken from Tesla PR in the comment I've replied to. The 0-100km/h times for M3 and Model 3 is 3.9 and 3.2 seconds respectively and, essentially, 20%. The difference in peak torque (helps in acceleration out of corners) is smaller, 550 N/m and 639 N/m, about 11%. Power (helps at high speed) difference also less - 317kW and 340kW, yet Tesla win here too. Model 3 is even slightly wider (2cm, about 1% wider), which should help in track too. And after all that, a whopping 0.1s of win. Tesla borked their very first Roadster, despite the fact that they had to provide only drivetrain to it and everything else was done by Lotus. The analysis above suggests that they are still do not get driving as opposed to drag racing.
    - xedeon 6y ago
      > "exceptional ride due to lower center of gravity and essentially middle engine design" That is a factual statement! Let me ask you this. Have you driven a decent mid-engine sports car like a Porsche 718 Boxster and a Tesla Model 3 performance? I have. They both handle quite well. >The 0-100km/h times for M3 and Model 3 is 3.9 and 3.2 seconds respectively and, essentially, 20%. The difference in peak torque (helps in acceleration out of corners) is smaller, 550 N/m and 639 N/m, about 11%. Power (helps at high speed) difference also less - 317kW and 340kW, yet Tesla win here too. Model 3 is even slightly wider (2cm, about 1% wider), which should help in track too. And after all that, a whopping 0.1s of win. Facts are facts, you can't spin it to suit your narrative. The Model 3 won while being heavier and costing significantly less is impressive. That was also prior to track mode being released and the new high performance package. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QXyEgl9rFN4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QXyEgl9rFN4 > Tesla borked their very first Roadster, despite the fact that they had to provide only drivetrain to it and everything else was done by Lotus. Do you have a background in automotive engineering? Elon Musk and the Tesla engineers said on many occasions, that the original Roadster only had about 20% original parts after they were done with the conversion. They also said that it would have been easier to start from scratch had they known the amount of hard work that had to be done. > The analysis above suggests that they are still do not get driving as opposed to drag racing. Terrible analysis. Randy Pobst (look him up) who is well respected in racing would tell you otherwise: https://youtu.be/aywleQX5lyA?t=202 https://youtu.be/aywleQX5lyA?t=202 Unplugged Performance Street Tuned Model 3 Beats McLaren F1 - Time Attack at Tsukuba Circuit https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2dustv6utY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2dustv6utY Tesla Model 3 prevails with two hill climb victories after Pikes Peak crash https://thedriven.io/2020/09/01/tesla-model-3-prevails-with-two-hill-climb-victories-after-pikes-peak-crash/ https://thedriven.io/2020/09/01/tesla-model-3-prevails-with-... Tesla Model 3 Performance Tire Rack Hot Lap https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgCf4aos0ZY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgCf4aos0ZY Randy Pobst Pikes Peak Hill Climb 2020 (Unplugged Performance Tesla Run) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvZMwiwnLVg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvZMwiwnLVg Pikes Peak Unplugged Performance Tesla Day 2 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q23I3BywBAA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q23I3BywBAA