4 ms·

The US government trampling all over your rights, digital and RL is very much a concern for everyone, hackers included.

wtn 15y ago
While I think the government policy is questionable, I am also concerned by the willingness of communications companies to respond to requests without warrants.
- omouse 15y ago
  Government and business are in bed together. This is how the capitalist system works.
  - mc32 15y ago
    I'd place a good bet it's not endemic of capitalist economic systems. Put another way, government and business (private or state or otherwise) necessarily operate with one another (co-operate). So implying that it's a trait solely of capitalism is not genuine.
    - billswift 15y ago
      Businesses don't have any choices - they cooperate or are shut down; they are even more vulnerable to state coercion than individuals are, both legal and sub-rosa actions.
      - Hoff 15y ago
        Or the businesses become rich enough or sufficiently well-connected, and they might buy the legal solutions they need through campaign and PAC and party contributions, through lobbying and other legal means, and through control of mass communications and dissemination of information, and discussions recently around the private enforcement of government regulations or the privatization of government functions. Now you could argue this is when a business transitions into a government-like entity, but that's another thread.
  - JanezStupar 15y ago
    No! That is how a fascist system works.
    - peterb 15y ago
      Fascists were very good at making money and owning private property. I think you are confusing capitalism with democracy and the rule of law.
      - JanezStupar 15y ago
        Yes... You're right, I did confuse the two. And I didn't seem to imply anything about fascists not being good at making money and owning property.
  - billybob 15y ago
    As opposed to... what? Communist systems, where the government directly owns the businesses? Capitalist systems are the ones with the LEAST amount of involvement between government and business. Yes, those relationships are often still too strong and even unethical, but at least they're not part of the government's basic mandate.
- jeromec 15y ago
  > I am also concerned by the willingness of communications companies to respond to requests without warrants. You probably don't want to read this then: http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2011/03/warrantless-eavesdropping/ http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2011/03/warrantless-eavesdr... It’s easy to forget these days, but former President George W. Bush’s illegal warrantless surveillance program was never halted by Congress, nor by the Obama administration. It was merely legalized in a 2008 law called the FISA Amendments Act. That means the surveillance of Americans’ international phone calls and internet use — complete with secret rooms in AT&T data centers around the country — is likely still ongoing.

wtn 15y ago

While I think the government policy is questionable, I am also concerned by the willingness of communications companies to respond to requests without warrants.

omouse 15y ago
Government and business are in bed together. This is how the capitalist system works.
- mc32 15y ago
  I'd place a good bet it's not endemic of capitalist economic systems. Put another way, government and business (private or state or otherwise) necessarily operate with one another (co-operate). So implying that it's a trait solely of capitalism is not genuine.
  - billswift 15y ago
    Businesses don't have any choices - they cooperate or are shut down; they are even more vulnerable to state coercion than individuals are, both legal and sub-rosa actions.
    - Hoff 15y ago
      Or the businesses become rich enough or sufficiently well-connected, and they might buy the legal solutions they need through campaign and PAC and party contributions, through lobbying and other legal means, and through control of mass communications and dissemination of information, and discussions recently around the private enforcement of government regulations or the privatization of government functions. Now you could argue this is when a business transitions into a government-like entity, but that's another thread.
- JanezStupar 15y ago
  No! That is how a fascist system works.
  - peterb 15y ago
    Fascists were very good at making money and owning private property. I think you are confusing capitalism with democracy and the rule of law.
    - JanezStupar 15y ago
      Yes... You're right, I did confuse the two. And I didn't seem to imply anything about fascists not being good at making money and owning property.
- billybob 15y ago
  As opposed to... what? Communist systems, where the government directly owns the businesses? Capitalist systems are the ones with the LEAST amount of involvement between government and business. Yes, those relationships are often still too strong and even unethical, but at least they're not part of the government's basic mandate.
jeromec 15y ago
> I am also concerned by the willingness of communications companies to respond to requests without warrants. You probably don't want to read this then: http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2011/03/warrantless-eavesdropping/ http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2011/03/warrantless-eavesdr... It’s easy to forget these days, but former President George W. Bush’s illegal warrantless surveillance program was never halted by Congress, nor by the Obama administration. It was merely legalized in a 2008 law called the FISA Amendments Act. That means the surveillance of Americans’ international phone calls and internet use — complete with secret rooms in AT&T data centers around the country — is likely still ongoing.