4 ms·

this is partially offset by the cost of living. for example you would pay roughly double for things such as rent and childcare in San Jose compared to Auckland

this is partially offset by the cost of living. for example you would pay roughly double for things such as rent and childcare in San Jose compared to Auckland (which is already much more expensive than the rest of NZ)

kls 6y ago
Right, while I don't live in that area, I do live in an area with a similar cost of living (Key West), rent on a decent home running near or above 3K and an apartment / townhome in the Key West Oldtown area can run up to 4K. Average dine out meal runs around $30 a plate and fine dining in the area of $50 a plate and up. Don't get me wrong at SV salaries they are not living hand to mouth but when you see those rates from a different cost of living area it can seem like ridiculous numbers but the reality is $150-$170K in that high of a COL area gives you enough to get a decent apartment in a reasonable commute distance, some pocket money for entertainment, healthcare, the ability to put away for a rainy day and it you live modest enough to pack away some retirement. The reality is that should be the base standard for a job. People should earn enough to provide for themselves, and secure their future. To me the fact that, that is no longer the norm in the US is what is shocking. An honest days labor, should command and honest wage, and to me those are the minimum things that should be secured in an honest wage. I see people down here in the FL keys working 2 jobs as the norm to make rent and to pay for the here and now, they cannot even fathom healthcare, rainy-day fund and retirement is not even on their radar. These are not people working restaurant or construction jobs, I see many "professional" jobs moonlight as bartenders, etc.
nullsense 6y ago
I did the math though and I would likely be clearing 100k in the bank even with the high cost of living there. Auckland is pretty expensive, and senior engineers here make a lot more than regular 9-5 jobs but I'm not remotely close to clearing that much money in a given year.
- JAlexoid 6y ago
  Relatively speaking you'd be having the same free cash flow proportionally. It's just that 10% of NZ$100k and US$400 is 4x the difference in absolute terms. You could go to Uber's Pittsburgh office and have a lot of money.... but you'd be in Pittsburgh... If you don't care about quality of life - there are great options world wide to make a lot of money. I would suggest getting into corruption, as an easy way of making millions fast.
  - nullsense 6y ago
    >Relatively speaking you'd be having the same free cash flow proportionally. It's just that 10% of NZ$100k and US$400 is 4x the difference in absolute terms I just don't think that's true. For two reasons: 1) I earn the equivalent of just under the median household income on my own, and 100% of my income is eaten by our expenses. It's really my wife's income that's left over after all that has been paid for, so none of mine is spare. 2) There must be hundreds of thousands of people who live in the bay area that don't work at FAANG and don't make anywhere near that, but still manage to live on the city somehow. It's not like if you make $360k you're barely scaping by, right!? Else basically everyone else would be homeless there. I ran the numbers and I'd be able to save a lot more.
    - JAlexoid 6y ago
      If you think that "crunching the numbers" is an appropriate way of comparing the cost of living in two completely different environments - you must be insane. If you have the fiscal responsibility and live a completely ascetic lifestyle - you can easily save most of your free cash flow. But that is an extraordinary person. If you are a reasonable person and are going to actually live in SF - you have to adjust your expenses accordingly. Your rent/mortgage, your shopping trips, your recreational activities, etc... and you realise that your social outing costs you $200, instead of $30... and you don't have the ability to host it at home, because all of your friends live 2-4 hours away or you have a $5000 p/m home in a convenient location. The reason why I say this - I lived in Helsinki, Dublin, London, NYC, San Francisco, Palo Alto and back to NYC. Me and my husband are both SWE, well paid. I literally went through the change of attitudes towards "living a life".

kls 6y ago

Right, while I don't live in that area, I do live in an area with a similar cost of living (Key West), rent on a decent home running near or above 3K and an apartment / townhome in the Key West Oldtown area can run up to 4K. Average dine out meal runs around $30 a plate and fine dining in the area of $50 a plate and up. Don't get me wrong at SV salaries they are not living hand to mouth but when you see those rates from a different cost of living area it can seem like ridiculous numbers but the reality is $150-$170K in that high of a COL area gives you enough to get a decent apartment in a reasonable commute distance, some pocket money for entertainment, healthcare, the ability to put away for a rainy day and it you live modest enough to pack away some retirement. The reality is that should be the base standard for a job. People should earn enough to provide for themselves, and secure their future. To me the fact that, that is no longer the norm in the US is what is shocking. An honest days labor, should command and honest wage, and to me those are the minimum things that should be secured in an honest wage. I see people down here in the FL keys working 2 jobs as the norm to make rent and to pay for the here and now, they cannot even fathom healthcare, rainy-day fund and retirement is not even on their radar. These are not people working restaurant or construction jobs, I see many "professional" jobs moonlight as bartenders, etc.

nullsense 6y ago

I did the math though and I would likely be clearing 100k in the bank even with the high cost of living there. Auckland is pretty expensive, and senior engineers here make a lot more than regular 9-5 jobs but I'm not remotely close to clearing that much money in a given year.

JAlexoid 6y ago
Relatively speaking you'd be having the same free cash flow proportionally. It's just that 10% of NZ$100k and US$400 is 4x the difference in absolute terms. You could go to Uber's Pittsburgh office and have a lot of money.... but you'd be in Pittsburgh... If you don't care about quality of life - there are great options world wide to make a lot of money. I would suggest getting into corruption, as an easy way of making millions fast.
- nullsense 6y ago
  >Relatively speaking you'd be having the same free cash flow proportionally. It's just that 10% of NZ$100k and US$400 is 4x the difference in absolute terms I just don't think that's true. For two reasons: 1) I earn the equivalent of just under the median household income on my own, and 100% of my income is eaten by our expenses. It's really my wife's income that's left over after all that has been paid for, so none of mine is spare. 2) There must be hundreds of thousands of people who live in the bay area that don't work at FAANG and don't make anywhere near that, but still manage to live on the city somehow. It's not like if you make $360k you're barely scaping by, right!? Else basically everyone else would be homeless there. I ran the numbers and I'd be able to save a lot more.
  - JAlexoid 6y ago
    If you think that "crunching the numbers" is an appropriate way of comparing the cost of living in two completely different environments - you must be insane. If you have the fiscal responsibility and live a completely ascetic lifestyle - you can easily save most of your free cash flow. But that is an extraordinary person. If you are a reasonable person and are going to actually live in SF - you have to adjust your expenses accordingly. Your rent/mortgage, your shopping trips, your recreational activities, etc... and you realise that your social outing costs you $200, instead of $30... and you don't have the ability to host it at home, because all of your friends live 2-4 hours away or you have a $5000 p/m home in a convenient location. The reason why I say this - I lived in Helsinki, Dublin, London, NYC, San Francisco, Palo Alto and back to NYC. Me and my husband are both SWE, well paid. I literally went through the change of attitudes towards "living a life".