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Confidential Amazon memo reveals new software to track unions

36 points by iamsanteri 6y ago

nanoscopic 6y ago
Guess who started the union-interest mailing group when working at Amazon HQ. Guess who is banned from ever working at Amazon again.
- iamsanteri 6y ago
  It’s truly incredible... I really love Amazon, but how come don’t they pay any federal taxes for years on end and wage war on their own workers... Does every large company become and/or act like this when they grow into serious market dominance? Aren’t they afraid of what could be the consequences? Do we really have to wait again for the regulation and antitrust authorities to put these guys in check... So many questions and thoughts.
  - nanoscopic 6y ago
    Amazon has very high internal costs and they also reinvest a lot of the money that is made into the company itself. The best way to view their "not paying tax" is from that perspective. If you have a business, and you make no "profit" because you reinvest every dollar of gross income back into the company, then it makes sense to be taxed much less by doing so. Additionally it is a misunderstanding that Amazon "doesn't pay tax." I looked into this myself after seeing all the hatred to Amazon about it, and they actually pay many types of tax and in high amounts. Everyone simply fixates on the taxes they are able to minimize. Every large company does their best to maximize profits and minimize losses for whatever reason. It is soulless but that is how companies function and is sensible from a certain perspective. I think they should also be "human" and not merely logical, but from a strictly logical viewpoint it makes sense to treat employees as disposable tools and get as many tax cuts as you can. What consequences? I think almost everyone knows Amazon is evil and heartless, but most of us continue to use Amazon to buy things anyway because they have the things we want at low costs.
just_steve_h 6y ago
Would now be a good time to remind savvy technical readers that it's crucial to have a solid grounding in ethics? It can be hard to draw a line when you work deep inside a system.
- ActorNightly 6y ago
  Not just have ethics, but also speak from facts that you know are true, not sensationalized stuff that you read on a blog post. The reason why Amazon is likely anti union is not because of any "evil overloards" that believe that workers are slaves to be exploited, but the warehousing/shipping business runs on very narrow margins, and any restrictions in this regard means they stop being #1. This is simply an economic reason in a capitalist framework, not anything out of malice. Based on the fact that they issued statements saying that people should petition government to raise the minimum wage, I think that if all the larger corporations were subject to unionization of workers, they would not have an issue with it. When everyone is on equal competitive ground, Amazon can win against the likes of WalMart and others.
  - barumi 6y ago
    > The reason why Amazon is likely anti union is not because of any "evil overloards" that believe that workers are slaves to be exploited, but the warehousing/shipping business runs on very narrow margins, and any restrictions in this regard means they stop being #1. Are you really trying to justify concerted effort to exploit people and rob people of basic rights and a decent living wage and work conditions because otherwise the richest company in the world might not have such a comfortable lead over the competition?
gentleman11 6y ago
A near future version of this: data companies will profile humans who are disruptive and sell profiles to potential employers. Anybody who tries to unionize once might be unemployable for years afterwards. The homeless person on the corner might have been a former line manager at the local distribution centre who thought working conditions were unsafe. This data will follow them forever
- noodlesUK 6y ago
  Which is why we desperately need legislation protecting workers rights do decide they want to collectively bargain, and protection from this kind of predatory bullshit. I couldn’t care less if Amazon workers want to unionise, but they shouldn’t be blacklisted or surveilled because some might wish to do so.

36 points by iamsanteri 6y ago

Guess who started the union-interest mailing group when working at Amazon HQ. Guess who is banned from ever working at Amazon again.

iamsanteri 6y ago
It’s truly incredible... I really love Amazon, but how come don’t they pay any federal taxes for years on end and wage war on their own workers... Does every large company become and/or act like this when they grow into serious market dominance? Aren’t they afraid of what could be the consequences? Do we really have to wait again for the regulation and antitrust authorities to put these guys in check... So many questions and thoughts.
- nanoscopic 6y ago
  Amazon has very high internal costs and they also reinvest a lot of the money that is made into the company itself. The best way to view their "not paying tax" is from that perspective. If you have a business, and you make no "profit" because you reinvest every dollar of gross income back into the company, then it makes sense to be taxed much less by doing so. Additionally it is a misunderstanding that Amazon "doesn't pay tax." I looked into this myself after seeing all the hatred to Amazon about it, and they actually pay many types of tax and in high amounts. Everyone simply fixates on the taxes they are able to minimize. Every large company does their best to maximize profits and minimize losses for whatever reason. It is soulless but that is how companies function and is sensible from a certain perspective. I think they should also be "human" and not merely logical, but from a strictly logical viewpoint it makes sense to treat employees as disposable tools and get as many tax cuts as you can. What consequences? I think almost everyone knows Amazon is evil and heartless, but most of us continue to use Amazon to buy things anyway because they have the things we want at low costs.

just_steve_h 6y ago

Would now be a good time to remind savvy technical readers that it's crucial to have a solid grounding in ethics? It can be hard to draw a line when you work deep inside a system.

ActorNightly 6y ago
Not just have ethics, but also speak from facts that you know are true, not sensationalized stuff that you read on a blog post. The reason why Amazon is likely anti union is not because of any "evil overloards" that believe that workers are slaves to be exploited, but the warehousing/shipping business runs on very narrow margins, and any restrictions in this regard means they stop being #1. This is simply an economic reason in a capitalist framework, not anything out of malice. Based on the fact that they issued statements saying that people should petition government to raise the minimum wage, I think that if all the larger corporations were subject to unionization of workers, they would not have an issue with it. When everyone is on equal competitive ground, Amazon can win against the likes of WalMart and others.
- barumi 6y ago
  > The reason why Amazon is likely anti union is not because of any "evil overloards" that believe that workers are slaves to be exploited, but the warehousing/shipping business runs on very narrow margins, and any restrictions in this regard means they stop being #1. Are you really trying to justify concerted effort to exploit people and rob people of basic rights and a decent living wage and work conditions because otherwise the richest company in the world might not have such a comfortable lead over the competition?

gentleman11 6y ago

A near future version of this: data companies will profile humans who are disruptive and sell profiles to potential employers. Anybody who tries to unionize once might be unemployable for years afterwards. The homeless person on the corner might have been a former line manager at the local distribution centre who thought working conditions were unsafe. This data will follow them forever

noodlesUK 6y ago
Which is why we desperately need legislation protecting workers rights do decide they want to collectively bargain, and protection from this kind of predatory bullshit. I couldn’t care less if Amazon workers want to unionise, but they shouldn’t be blacklisted or surveilled because some might wish to do so.