5 ms·

Not sure if it is on the same level of realism as those listed for evertyhign, but "The Expanse" series by James S. A. Corey for me was a breath of fresh air.

Not sure if it is on the same level of realism as those listed for evertyhign, but "The Expanse" series by James S. A. Corey for me was a breath of fresh air. The book really considers things like the time it would take to go from Earth to Mars, or the edge of the Solar System, and also take into account gravity forces in battles and other events. It still has a lot of very sci-fi things in some areas, but it was very interesting to see that going from Earth to somewhere after Neptune really took 8+ months for the passengers, including some of the psychological stress of spending that much time together on a small ship. The TV Series is also good but misses a lot of those little things that the books explicitly deal with. It became my favorite book series because of that. No magically going to another galaxy in the blink of an eye. Going to another planet always required planning, sacrifices, time, etc. In addition it also has some pretty nice politics compared to other space stories.

avaldeso 6y ago
> No magically going to another galaxy in the blink of an eye. Spoiler alert. They do though, kinda. Thousands of systems but all in the Milky Way.
- hugocbp 6y ago
  I tried to keep all examples very, very general not to spoil anything. As a good sci-fi, the books will use some magic here and there, but it is very discrete, in my opinion. Not even close to what most popular space stories do for convenience. I gladly accept that part you are talking about since it came with a very good balance in other areas.
  - eslaught 6y ago
    In my opinion it's better to know that not strictly hard sci-fi. Let me explain, since I think this is an aspect of writing that's not widely appreciated. The beginning of a book essentially sets up "promises" for what the rest of the book is going to be like. In the case of Leviathan Wakes, I think it's entirely reasonable to see the book as making a promise that it's hard sci-fi, given that it's trying so hard to be. All of the little details, like you say, are made very obvious in the beginning. And then, you get a good ways into the book, and suddenly you realize that it's not really hard sci-fi after all. It can be a serious let-down since the book was leading you on to believe it was fully hard sci-fi. Now I'm not actually a huge fan of hard sci-fi per se, but this did irritate me that I didn't bother to pick up any of the sequels. Maybe I'll get back to it some day, since I do think some of the almost-hard details are nice, and now that I know to set the right expectations.
    - seer 6y ago
      There are so many things the author got right throughout the Expanse books - physics, politics, character progression, character impact. He just added a pinch of sci fi to make things interesting and different, but in a good way. It starts as a bit of duex ex machina yes, but its never inconsistent. Any new progression seems logical from the old, so its easy to follow and doesn’t break the world view you develop for the series. Also one of the best things the book got right for me is the scale of character’s actions. You don’t have mega heroes. The good guys just try to survive in the big universe and do good, but it doesn’t always work out the way they want as the world is big and you have unintended consequences. It felt very real. It does have mega villains though, which were a bit _too_ powerful in my opinion, but not without historical precedent I’m afraid.
    - garmaine 6y ago
      This was me with the TV series. Most of the first and second season are hard sci-if in the strictest sense. Just what the protomolecule is remained a mystery, but but it was a tiny alien enigma within a realistic near-term hard sci-fi universe that was and still is unlike anything else on TV. Then the big reveal happened (in season 3, I think?) and it’s like the bottom dropped out. I legit stopped watching at that point, although I’m considering giving it another chance now. Had I known upfront I think I would have been more forgiving, but instead I felt deceived. All that said, the Epstein drive is nearly as magic as the usual hyperspace trope. Even in the beginning The Expanse isn’t as hard sci-fi as it purports to be.
    - caconym_ 6y ago
      Leviathan Wakes would not be nearly as good if the exact nature of what comes later was broadcast early on, though the prologue does make it quite clear that the central mystery is going to lead somewhere outside of established science fact. That’s the promise it makes: that there’s something strange going on, and that by the end of the book you’re going to know more about it, and about what happened to the point-of-view character. IMO, straying out of the lane of the subgenre that someone going in with no foreknowledge happened to sort a story into without reading the whole thing first is pretty low on the big list of literary sins. On the contrary, I think a genre switch-up executed well is a delightful thing, mostly because complications and reversals are critical elements of most good plots and genre is completely arbitrary and artificial. All other things being equal, a story that tiptoes around genre conventions is never going to be more interesting than one that goes where it wants.
cortesoft 6y ago
Haven't read the books, but enjoyed the series... one of the first series set in space where g-forces and the physiological effects of zero-g play prominent roles in the story
kevin_thibedeau 6y ago
I can't recommend the Expanse series. The first two books are interesting. The next two are loaded with boring human conflict that slowly progresses with lots of filler. The big bads do crazy pointless shit just to drive the thin plots. It is essentially Game of Thrones in space. The authors are deliberately stretching the stories to milk the series.
- alexgmcm 6y ago
  I just recently finished all of the books. The third and fourth books are the weakest by far and are actually done much better by the TV series than the books. The TV series version of Ashford is an actual deep character and not just a 2d caricature. Equally, all of the schoolgirl romance stuff in Cibola Burn is removed. The rest of the books are pretty decent though I thought, so if you stopped at Cibola Burn I'd recommend Nemesis Games and the rest.

avaldeso 6y ago

> No magically going to another galaxy in the blink of an eye. Spoiler alert. They do though, kinda. Thousands of systems but all in the Milky Way.

hugocbp 6y ago
I tried to keep all examples very, very general not to spoil anything. As a good sci-fi, the books will use some magic here and there, but it is very discrete, in my opinion. Not even close to what most popular space stories do for convenience. I gladly accept that part you are talking about since it came with a very good balance in other areas.
- eslaught 6y ago
  In my opinion it's better to know that not strictly hard sci-fi. Let me explain, since I think this is an aspect of writing that's not widely appreciated. The beginning of a book essentially sets up "promises" for what the rest of the book is going to be like. In the case of Leviathan Wakes, I think it's entirely reasonable to see the book as making a promise that it's hard sci-fi, given that it's trying so hard to be. All of the little details, like you say, are made very obvious in the beginning. And then, you get a good ways into the book, and suddenly you realize that it's not really hard sci-fi after all. It can be a serious let-down since the book was leading you on to believe it was fully hard sci-fi. Now I'm not actually a huge fan of hard sci-fi per se, but this did irritate me that I didn't bother to pick up any of the sequels. Maybe I'll get back to it some day, since I do think some of the almost-hard details are nice, and now that I know to set the right expectations.
  - seer 6y ago
    There are so many things the author got right throughout the Expanse books - physics, politics, character progression, character impact. He just added a pinch of sci fi to make things interesting and different, but in a good way. It starts as a bit of duex ex machina yes, but its never inconsistent. Any new progression seems logical from the old, so its easy to follow and doesn’t break the world view you develop for the series. Also one of the best things the book got right for me is the scale of character’s actions. You don’t have mega heroes. The good guys just try to survive in the big universe and do good, but it doesn’t always work out the way they want as the world is big and you have unintended consequences. It felt very real. It does have mega villains though, which were a bit _too_ powerful in my opinion, but not without historical precedent I’m afraid.
  - garmaine 6y ago
    This was me with the TV series. Most of the first and second season are hard sci-if in the strictest sense. Just what the protomolecule is remained a mystery, but but it was a tiny alien enigma within a realistic near-term hard sci-fi universe that was and still is unlike anything else on TV. Then the big reveal happened (in season 3, I think?) and it’s like the bottom dropped out. I legit stopped watching at that point, although I’m considering giving it another chance now. Had I known upfront I think I would have been more forgiving, but instead I felt deceived. All that said, the Epstein drive is nearly as magic as the usual hyperspace trope. Even in the beginning The Expanse isn’t as hard sci-fi as it purports to be.
  - caconym_ 6y ago
    Leviathan Wakes would not be nearly as good if the exact nature of what comes later was broadcast early on, though the prologue does make it quite clear that the central mystery is going to lead somewhere outside of established science fact. That’s the promise it makes: that there’s something strange going on, and that by the end of the book you’re going to know more about it, and about what happened to the point-of-view character. IMO, straying out of the lane of the subgenre that someone going in with no foreknowledge happened to sort a story into without reading the whole thing first is pretty low on the big list of literary sins. On the contrary, I think a genre switch-up executed well is a delightful thing, mostly because complications and reversals are critical elements of most good plots and genre is completely arbitrary and artificial. All other things being equal, a story that tiptoes around genre conventions is never going to be more interesting than one that goes where it wants.

cortesoft 6y ago

Haven't read the books, but enjoyed the series... one of the first series set in space where g-forces and the physiological effects of zero-g play prominent roles in the story

kevin_thibedeau 6y ago

I can't recommend the Expanse series. The first two books are interesting. The next two are loaded with boring human conflict that slowly progresses with lots of filler. The big bads do crazy pointless shit just to drive the thin plots. It is essentially Game of Thrones in space. The authors are deliberately stretching the stories to milk the series.

alexgmcm 6y ago
I just recently finished all of the books. The third and fourth books are the weakest by far and are actually done much better by the TV series than the books. The TV series version of Ashford is an actual deep character and not just a 2d caricature. Equally, all of the schoolgirl romance stuff in Cibola Burn is removed. The rest of the books are pretty decent though I thought, so if you stopped at Cibola Burn I'd recommend Nemesis Games and the rest.