4 ms·

> People use excel sheets as databases all the time because it doesn't require any specialist knowledge to build or use. Test and Trace is a multi billion poun

by DanBC 6y ago

> People use excel sheets as databases all the time because it doesn't require any specialist knowledge to build or use. Test and Trace is a multi billion pound programme of work, involving huge companies (eg, Serco) interfacing with national governmental bodies (Public Health England). We've had months to get something in place. One of the reasons organisations like Serco is used is their apparent expertise with IT.

pjc50 6y ago
The main reason Serco is used is their political connections; they really ought to have been banned from consideration after the fraud scandal: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-50806919 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-50806919 (my one-step programme for improving UK public contracting would be that after a significant failed contract the contracting company and its directors and any other companies they are directors of would be banned from tendering for a period; maybe a couple of years?)
- jasiek 6y ago
  Unfortunately the procurement rules currently in place prevent procurement personnel evaluating a tender from taking into account any prior performance. I'm unsure whether this is a result of EU legislation and common market rules, or whether it is just the UK.
  - riffraff 6y ago
    italy has legislation to forbid people who engaged in corruption/embezzlement from working with public administrations. It also has a required certification for companies that work with the public that they weren't condemned for certain crimes (trafficking in illegal waste, extorsion, organized crime etc). So, it doesn't seem an EU/Single Market rule that you can't check this.
  - anonymousDan 6y ago
    Please tell me that is not true. That is just...nuts! What is the rationale behind that beyond corruption?
- thu2111 6y ago
  One issue they have is that very few companies are willing to have the government as a customer. That's one reason why they keep going back to the same failed firms time and time again. Reasons vary but the ones I've seen are generally: 1. Complex procurement regulations that take a lot of effort to comply with by contractors. 2. Low willingness to pay (both price-wise and time-wise). 3. Civil servants are nightmare customers who don't know what they want and are under no pressure to figure it out, so there's a lot of timewasting involved. 4. PR nightmare if/when things go wrong even if it's not your fault, as government is relatively open compared to other types of customers so easier to find out about problems, and lots of people automatically blame the private sector in preference to blaming government employees due to (misguided) assumptions of moral superiority of the public sector.

by DanBC 6y ago

pjc50 6y ago

The main reason Serco is used is their political connections; they really ought to have been banned from consideration after the fraud scandal: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-50806919 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-50806919 (my one-step programme for improving UK public contracting would be that after a significant failed contract the contracting company and its directors and any other companies they are directors of would be banned from tendering for a period; maybe a couple of years?)

jasiek 6y ago
Unfortunately the procurement rules currently in place prevent procurement personnel evaluating a tender from taking into account any prior performance. I'm unsure whether this is a result of EU legislation and common market rules, or whether it is just the UK.
- riffraff 6y ago
  italy has legislation to forbid people who engaged in corruption/embezzlement from working with public administrations. It also has a required certification for companies that work with the public that they weren't condemned for certain crimes (trafficking in illegal waste, extorsion, organized crime etc). So, it doesn't seem an EU/Single Market rule that you can't check this.
- anonymousDan 6y ago
  Please tell me that is not true. That is just...nuts! What is the rationale behind that beyond corruption?
thu2111 6y ago
One issue they have is that very few companies are willing to have the government as a customer. That's one reason why they keep going back to the same failed firms time and time again. Reasons vary but the ones I've seen are generally: 1. Complex procurement regulations that take a lot of effort to comply with by contractors. 2. Low willingness to pay (both price-wise and time-wise). 3. Civil servants are nightmare customers who don't know what they want and are under no pressure to figure it out, so there's a lot of timewasting involved. 4. PR nightmare if/when things go wrong even if it's not your fault, as government is relatively open compared to other types of customers so easier to find out about problems, and lots of people automatically blame the private sector in preference to blaming government employees due to (misguided) assumptions of moral superiority of the public sector.