3 ms·

You have Intel to blame here. The ARM MacBooks will change everything.

by gigatexal 6y ago

pettycashstash2 6y ago
How so. Can you provide some concrete examples?
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- _ph_ 6y ago
  Judging how well the iPhone processors perform in compute tasks, one can expect even higher performance when there is 10x the thermal budget avialable, as in a 16" laptop. There is all reason to expect impressive performance.
toyg 6y ago
The 2012-2015 processors were just fine, did new ones get any slower? Nope. Blame Apple for being so obsessed with thinness over cooling requirements.
- my123 6y ago
  Those were dual-cores for 13'' models and quad-cores for 15'' models. Since Kaby Lake-R however, on the same manufacturing process (with some refinements), core counts increased massively on the Intel side. That made power usage more than double with the increased turbos too.
gigatexal 6y ago
To all the down-voters: think about it. The chips in the phones are not actively cooled and run circles around their Intel equivalents. Apple won’t change the thinness and cooling characteristics of their laptops but were likely hoping Intel would improve their processes such that they’d run cooler. Now that Apple will have control over the silicon and even have the actively cooled potential performance should rise not to mention all the acceleration they’re building into the chips themselves. I don’t have hard evidence other than the initial performance of the dev kits and the utmost bullish take on Apple’s in-house chip designers: I don’t know why anyone would bet against them. That being said I think the OS is holding the platform back a ton. For me Docker is a huge part of my workflow and the need for a Linux VM is a deal breaker on my Mac. Spinning up docker means my mac’s fans scream at almost 100%. I hate that. Since moving to an admittedly uglier Dell Linux laptop (not an XPS) I don’t have that same issue.
- higeorge13 6y ago
  I can't upvote more on the docker comment. Docker in OSX is terrible, it has caused tons of problems on every single developer with a MBP i know, while in other platforms is so much better.
- FpUser 6y ago
  I'd rather go to something with AMD CPU. They make way more sense lately
  - gigatexal 6y ago
    Still the same issue of CISC v RISC. The ARM ISA as I understand it is simpler hence why when well architected it will be faster especially with a 2T dollar company behind it.
    - FpUser 6y ago
      When/if it will then I can think about it. For now AMD is faster. On top of that no need to change deployment target is a big plus.
    - ksec 6y ago
      >Still the same issue of CISC v RISC. God No. Why is this happening on HN as well. It has absolutely nothing to do with CISC vs RISC. x86 ( with all modern instruction sets add on ) is Complex, doesn't make a less complex ISA like ARMv8 RISC.
      - gigatexal 6y ago
        Um? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_architecture https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_architecture
thesuperbigfrog 6y ago
>> You have Intel to blame here. Intel is not responsible for the software problems or keyboard issues. >> The ARM MacBooks will change everything. Remains to be seen. I really hope they are. My 2010 MacBook Air was hands down the best portable I've ever owned. It lasted for nearly nine years and was still running surprisingly well until the end. I am really hesitant to get an Apple replacement given the issues brought up in these comments and Apple Silicon on the horizon. I'll wait and see.
- gigatexal 6y ago
  Keyboard issues and software issues are indeed not Intel’s fault. In fact, Intel failing to make their process changes, means we have Intel to thank for Apple either speeding up their transition or for it happening it all. The Apple build quality is second to none. That my 2013 MacBook Pro is still going strong is a testament to that. And the keyboard fiasco means they had a time when form won over function but I see them reverting to the old keyboard as function coming back into relevance. I’m hoping for an Apple Silicon MacBook Air or something equivalent to to replace my heavy pro — but it’d be for personal use not professional given my reservations posted above and since Desktop Linux has come so far.

You have Intel to blame here. The ARM MacBooks will change everything.

pettycashstash2 6y ago

How so. Can you provide some concrete examples?

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
_ph_ 6y ago
Judging how well the iPhone processors perform in compute tasks, one can expect even higher performance when there is 10x the thermal budget avialable, as in a 16" laptop. There is all reason to expect impressive performance.

toyg 6y ago

The 2012-2015 processors were just fine, did new ones get any slower? Nope. Blame Apple for being so obsessed with thinness over cooling requirements.

my123 6y ago
Those were dual-cores for 13'' models and quad-cores for 15'' models. Since Kaby Lake-R however, on the same manufacturing process (with some refinements), core counts increased massively on the Intel side. That made power usage more than double with the increased turbos too.

gigatexal 6y ago

To all the down-voters: think about it. The chips in the phones are not actively cooled and run circles around their Intel equivalents. Apple won’t change the thinness and cooling characteristics of their laptops but were likely hoping Intel would improve their processes such that they’d run cooler. Now that Apple will have control over the silicon and even have the actively cooled potential performance should rise not to mention all the acceleration they’re building into the chips themselves. I don’t have hard evidence other than the initial performance of the dev kits and the utmost bullish take on Apple’s in-house chip designers: I don’t know why anyone would bet against them. That being said I think the OS is holding the platform back a ton. For me Docker is a huge part of my workflow and the need for a Linux VM is a deal breaker on my Mac. Spinning up docker means my mac’s fans scream at almost 100%. I hate that. Since moving to an admittedly uglier Dell Linux laptop (not an XPS) I don’t have that same issue.

higeorge13 6y ago
I can't upvote more on the docker comment. Docker in OSX is terrible, it has caused tons of problems on every single developer with a MBP i know, while in other platforms is so much better.
FpUser 6y ago
I'd rather go to something with AMD CPU. They make way more sense lately
- gigatexal 6y ago
  Still the same issue of CISC v RISC. The ARM ISA as I understand it is simpler hence why when well architected it will be faster especially with a 2T dollar company behind it.
  - FpUser 6y ago
    When/if it will then I can think about it. For now AMD is faster. On top of that no need to change deployment target is a big plus.
  - ksec 6y ago
    >Still the same issue of CISC v RISC. God No. Why is this happening on HN as well. It has absolutely nothing to do with CISC vs RISC. x86 ( with all modern instruction sets add on ) is Complex, doesn't make a less complex ISA like ARMv8 RISC.
    - gigatexal 6y ago
      Um? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_architecture https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_architecture

thesuperbigfrog 6y ago

>> You have Intel to blame here. Intel is not responsible for the software problems or keyboard issues. >> The ARM MacBooks will change everything. Remains to be seen. I really hope they are. My 2010 MacBook Air was hands down the best portable I've ever owned. It lasted for nearly nine years and was still running surprisingly well until the end. I am really hesitant to get an Apple replacement given the issues brought up in these comments and Apple Silicon on the horizon. I'll wait and see.

gigatexal 6y ago
Keyboard issues and software issues are indeed not Intel’s fault. In fact, Intel failing to make their process changes, means we have Intel to thank for Apple either speeding up their transition or for it happening it all. The Apple build quality is second to none. That my 2013 MacBook Pro is still going strong is a testament to that. And the keyboard fiasco means they had a time when form won over function but I see them reverting to the old keyboard as function coming back into relevance. I’m hoping for an Apple Silicon MacBook Air or something equivalent to to replace my heavy pro — but it’d be for personal use not professional given my reservations posted above and since Desktop Linux has come so far.