5 ms·

Does no one else agree with me that this is awesome? I love being able to visualize my comings and goings. It's the story of the last year or so of my life, in

by edw 16y ago

Does no one else agree with me that this is awesome? I love being able to visualize my comings and goings. It's the story of the last year or so of my life, in colored dots. I hope Apple doesn't respond to the "outrage" by no longer collecting this data. To a first order approximation, I am with Scott McNealy over in the "Privacy?! Get over it" camp: http://www.wired.com/politics/law/news/1999/01/17538 http://www.wired.com/politics/law/news/1999/01/17538 As an aside, can real outrage even exist anymore in this age of the easy forum post or re-tweet or tumblr entry or Facebook post? And if it does, how do you identify it? And if you can identify it, what does it mean?

jokermatt999 16y ago
I love being able to visualize my comings and goings. Then use something like Latitude. There are options for you if you want to see this data other than having Apple collect data from all users whether they like it or not.
- edw 16y ago
  I think you are confused: you say that "Apple collect[s] data." Apple's software is collecting data, but is it the case that Apple has access to this data? I don't think so. There are issues of agency here: in my interpretation of things, my phone is collecting and storing the data, Apple isn't. I guess I have some sort of perverse desire to see my karma auger into the x axis thanks to this issue, because people seem to be whiny hysterics on it. Computers log data. A phone is a computer. The history of the phone's location is conceivably useful—it's like a geospatial stack trace—and even if this data is going to the Apple mothership, I don't care as long as the data gets Tivo-ified.
  - jokermatt999 16y ago
    I said "Apple collects data" as a shorthand for "Apple's software collects data and stores it on your phone" because the distinction you're making seems to be meaningless to most people. I can see your point though. Still, I don't see why this is better than an optional, third party application for this data. I also think that people should be upset at their phone keeping this data without their knowledge. You say it could be useful, but useful to whom? Advertisers, stalkers, "The Government"? I can't see how this useful to most users at all. computers log data, A phone is a computer. I think most people view their phone somewhat more intimately than their computer. Notice the uproar any time privacy issues like these are raised about a phone. Furthermore, tracking someone's location is just about the creepiest thing you could do for most people. It's just ripe for abuse, and as I stated earlier, I can't see much in the way of positive use.
    - Angostura 16y ago
      "the distinction you're making seems to be meaningless to most people" No, the distinction is critical to most people. Apple's iPhone software records all the calls I make, the phone numbers I call and the duration. That's fine. I'd be pretty peeved if that information was harvested by Apple Inc.
pavel_lishin 16y ago
Sex is pretty awesome, too, unless you don't get any say in the matter.
- edw 16y ago
  Wow, you're making a rape analogy. Glad you decided to stay classy and not make your post an instance of Godwin's Law.
  - ugh 16y ago
    The comparison is very apt. Consent often changes how we view things. Rape and privacy violations are not the same but when it comes to consent very similar.
    - edw 16y ago
      So you think it's defensible to say that Apple is raping its users? Let's get some people who have been victims of rape in here and ask them how they feel about this over-the-top analogy.
      - ugh 16y ago
        For comparisons to be useful, you don't have to take everything literally. As far as the question of consent is concerned, the comparison is apt.
        edw 16y ago
        But why make the comparison if not to inflame? That's the point, isn't it? Comparing data collection to sex in the context of consent—as if the concept of consent applies in the same way, which is on its face a bold assertion—isn't about a logical argument, it's about trying to win a war over people's sentiments. And I think the sentiment that's being fought for here is irresponsible and simplistic.
        16y ago
flipbrad 16y ago
if the feature was opt-in it might, conceivably, be called awesome. But not being told that my iDevice will log my every move and leave this data open to the next johnny-come-lately to get his hands on my device? Terribly uncool. Logging should be a setting, or better, an app. Not a hidden, no opt-out feature imposed on over a hundred million iDevice owners.
- calloc 16y ago
  Set up a passcode, now they can't access the data on your phone unless they have the passcode, or your iTunes plist file ...
shekmalhen 16y ago
Can you please put it somewhere on the Internet. I'd love to look at it. Thank you in advance.
- edw 16y ago
  You're welcome: http://bbb.poseur.com/post/4777454362/the-last-year-or-so-of-my-life-not-including-a http://bbb.poseur.com/post/4777454362/the-last-year-or-so-of...
  - seats 16y ago
    Great follow through. I kind of agree with you. I'm not sure what I'd use the data for, but I sure did enjoy looking back on where I was. My amusement outweighs my outrage.
  - anonymous246 16y ago
    I think he asked for the full database dump, not a meaningless country-level zoomed screenshot. But I give you props for revealing even this much; I would have certainly not done so.
    - edw 16y ago
      I was going to do so, if only to prove that I don't give a shit, but after glancing at the instructions, I'm not going to do it unless someone provides me with a shell script. It's too much of a pain in the ass. But if any of you are pathetic and creepy enough to want to know where I was on any particular day, feel free to send me e-mail at edw@poseur.com and I'll let you know.
      - anonymous246 16y ago
        Do you use Mac? It seems writing a script would be easier for Mac. I can try to cook one up. I will post it here if I succeed.

by edw 16y ago

jokermatt999 16y ago

I love being able to visualize my comings and goings. Then use something like Latitude. There are options for you if you want to see this data other than having Apple collect data from all users whether they like it or not.

edw 16y ago
I think you are confused: you say that "Apple collect[s] data." Apple's software is collecting data, but is it the case that Apple has access to this data? I don't think so. There are issues of agency here: in my interpretation of things, my phone is collecting and storing the data, Apple isn't. I guess I have some sort of perverse desire to see my karma auger into the x axis thanks to this issue, because people seem to be whiny hysterics on it. Computers log data. A phone is a computer. The history of the phone's location is conceivably useful—it's like a geospatial stack trace—and even if this data is going to the Apple mothership, I don't care as long as the data gets Tivo-ified.
- jokermatt999 16y ago
  I said "Apple collects data" as a shorthand for "Apple's software collects data and stores it on your phone" because the distinction you're making seems to be meaningless to most people. I can see your point though. Still, I don't see why this is better than an optional, third party application for this data. I also think that people should be upset at their phone keeping this data without their knowledge. You say it could be useful, but useful to whom? Advertisers, stalkers, "The Government"? I can't see how this useful to most users at all. computers log data, A phone is a computer. I think most people view their phone somewhat more intimately than their computer. Notice the uproar any time privacy issues like these are raised about a phone. Furthermore, tracking someone's location is just about the creepiest thing you could do for most people. It's just ripe for abuse, and as I stated earlier, I can't see much in the way of positive use.
  - Angostura 16y ago
    "the distinction you're making seems to be meaningless to most people" No, the distinction is critical to most people. Apple's iPhone software records all the calls I make, the phone numbers I call and the duration. That's fine. I'd be pretty peeved if that information was harvested by Apple Inc.

pavel_lishin 16y ago

Sex is pretty awesome, too, unless you don't get any say in the matter.

edw 16y ago
Wow, you're making a rape analogy. Glad you decided to stay classy and not make your post an instance of Godwin's Law.
- ugh 16y ago
  The comparison is very apt. Consent often changes how we view things. Rape and privacy violations are not the same but when it comes to consent very similar.
  - edw 16y ago
    So you think it's defensible to say that Apple is raping its users? Let's get some people who have been victims of rape in here and ask them how they feel about this over-the-top analogy.
    - ugh 16y ago
      For comparisons to be useful, you don't have to take everything literally. As far as the question of consent is concerned, the comparison is apt.
      - edw 16y ago
        But why make the comparison if not to inflame? That's the point, isn't it? Comparing data collection to sex in the context of consent—as if the concept of consent applies in the same way, which is on its face a bold assertion—isn't about a logical argument, it's about trying to win a war over people's sentiments. And I think the sentiment that's being fought for here is irresponsible and simplistic.
        16y ago

flipbrad 16y ago

if the feature was opt-in it might, conceivably, be called awesome. But not being told that my iDevice will log my every move and leave this data open to the next johnny-come-lately to get his hands on my device? Terribly uncool. Logging should be a setting, or better, an app. Not a hidden, no opt-out feature imposed on over a hundred million iDevice owners.

calloc 16y ago
Set up a passcode, now they can't access the data on your phone unless they have the passcode, or your iTunes plist file ...

shekmalhen 16y ago

Can you please put it somewhere on the Internet. I'd love to look at it. Thank you in advance.

edw 16y ago
You're welcome: http://bbb.poseur.com/post/4777454362/the-last-year-or-so-of-my-life-not-including-a http://bbb.poseur.com/post/4777454362/the-last-year-or-so-of...
- seats 16y ago
  Great follow through. I kind of agree with you. I'm not sure what I'd use the data for, but I sure did enjoy looking back on where I was. My amusement outweighs my outrage.
- anonymous246 16y ago
  I think he asked for the full database dump, not a meaningless country-level zoomed screenshot. But I give you props for revealing even this much; I would have certainly not done so.
  - edw 16y ago
    I was going to do so, if only to prove that I don't give a shit, but after glancing at the instructions, I'm not going to do it unless someone provides me with a shell script. It's too much of a pain in the ass. But if any of you are pathetic and creepy enough to want to know where I was on any particular day, feel free to send me e-mail at edw@poseur.com and I'll let you know.
    - anonymous246 16y ago
      Do you use Mac? It seems writing a script would be easier for Mac. I can try to cook one up. I will post it here if I succeed.