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Hmm. I thought the IMF and World Bank were there to make sure dictators run off with billions, scott free, and the citizens of the countries that they "ran" are

Hmm. I thought the IMF and World Bank were there to make sure dictators run off with billions, scott free, and the citizens of the countries that they "ran" are stuck with the bill and the lovely austerity measures?

andrewjl 6y ago
It generally helps to read multiple perspectives before adopting such an extreme view. Obviously that's not true.
- blululu 6y ago
  The parent is a sarcastic exaggeration but it is not totally false. The IMF has changed a lot in the last 20 years, but they had a streak in the 80s where they would force third world countries to scrap their social welfare systems to pay off debt on loans that were foolishly made to previous unelected dictators.
  - andrewjl 6y ago
    I'm not familiar with the details, but if they were at all similar to the mid-2010s Greek situation then they were not sustainable, irrespective of IMFs involvement. Generally I think there are better ways to grow economy than pure austerity, but the details do matter.
  - ClumsyPilot 6y ago
    Is a country responsiblebfor debts incurred by an illegitimate govermnet? Like imagine someone forced you to tale out a loan at gunpoint - that wouldn't fly
- TaylorAlexander 6y ago
  Y’all should give this a watch: https://youtu.be/WYCH1Ylncxc https://youtu.be/WYCH1Ylncxc
  - andrewjl 6y ago
    Generally banal factual statements selectively arranged to form a narrative aimed at furthering a particular political agenda. TIL Fox News aren't the only ones that do this! Edit: If conspiratorial stuff like this is the entirety of your media diet, you're going to have a hopelessly warped view of reality.
    - TheNorthman 6y ago
      The video is 21 minutes long and you commented on it's contents 7 minutes after OP posted the link. I think it's also fair to assume some time went by between OP posting and you seeing their comment. How did you find the time to view the clip thoroughly enough to dismiss it so nonchalantly?
      - andrewjl 6y ago
        I'm well familiar with the directors other work to know he has next to zero credibility on economic issues. And after reading the directors quotes on the 2016 election[1], I don't think he has any credibility period. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Pilger https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Pilger
        TheNorthman 6y ago
        Your rejection of Pilger is baseless and your reduction of his works as dealing with `economic issues' is equally so. Your comments reminds me of Slavoj Zizek's phrase: ideological par excellence in that while you're free to think of Pilger as you want, even biased, you're not absolved of similar issues. Putting the topic on its head, he is still widely respected in academia by amongst others, IIRC, Chomsky
        andrewjl 6y ago
        I never reduced his works to dealing with economic issues and saying so is a misreading of what I wrote. What I meant was that the aspects of his work that do focus on economic issues betray a lack of technical understanding and a clear ideological agenda that biases presentation. The former is especially useful to the latter in that it uses deliberate ambiguities to allow one to sprout falsehoods via false analogy and omission. One can then lie by stating facts, selectively. If that's what you enjoy watching, that's cool man, but just keep in mind it's fiction and is of very little practical use besides entertainment value. Definitely don't try to build a political movement based on it! Unless you want it to fail. Repeatedly.

andrewjl 6y ago

It generally helps to read multiple perspectives before adopting such an extreme view. Obviously that's not true.

blululu 6y ago
The parent is a sarcastic exaggeration but it is not totally false. The IMF has changed a lot in the last 20 years, but they had a streak in the 80s where they would force third world countries to scrap their social welfare systems to pay off debt on loans that were foolishly made to previous unelected dictators.
- andrewjl 6y ago
  I'm not familiar with the details, but if they were at all similar to the mid-2010s Greek situation then they were not sustainable, irrespective of IMFs involvement. Generally I think there are better ways to grow economy than pure austerity, but the details do matter.
- ClumsyPilot 6y ago
  Is a country responsiblebfor debts incurred by an illegitimate govermnet? Like imagine someone forced you to tale out a loan at gunpoint - that wouldn't fly
TaylorAlexander 6y ago
Y’all should give this a watch: https://youtu.be/WYCH1Ylncxc https://youtu.be/WYCH1Ylncxc
- andrewjl 6y ago
  Generally banal factual statements selectively arranged to form a narrative aimed at furthering a particular political agenda. TIL Fox News aren't the only ones that do this! Edit: If conspiratorial stuff like this is the entirety of your media diet, you're going to have a hopelessly warped view of reality.
  - TheNorthman 6y ago
    The video is 21 minutes long and you commented on it's contents 7 minutes after OP posted the link. I think it's also fair to assume some time went by between OP posting and you seeing their comment. How did you find the time to view the clip thoroughly enough to dismiss it so nonchalantly?
    - andrewjl 6y ago
      I'm well familiar with the directors other work to know he has next to zero credibility on economic issues. And after reading the directors quotes on the 2016 election[1], I don't think he has any credibility period. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Pilger https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Pilger
      - TheNorthman 6y ago
        Your rejection of Pilger is baseless and your reduction of his works as dealing with `economic issues' is equally so. Your comments reminds me of Slavoj Zizek's phrase: ideological par excellence in that while you're free to think of Pilger as you want, even biased, you're not absolved of similar issues. Putting the topic on its head, he is still widely respected in academia by amongst others, IIRC, Chomsky
        andrewjl 6y ago
        I never reduced his works to dealing with economic issues and saying so is a misreading of what I wrote. What I meant was that the aspects of his work that do focus on economic issues betray a lack of technical understanding and a clear ideological agenda that biases presentation. The former is especially useful to the latter in that it uses deliberate ambiguities to allow one to sprout falsehoods via false analogy and omission. One can then lie by stating facts, selectively. If that's what you enjoy watching, that's cool man, but just keep in mind it's fiction and is of very little practical use besides entertainment value. Definitely don't try to build a political movement based on it! Unless you want it to fail. Repeatedly.