4 ms·

Just to make a minor point clear, since it seems the article is a bit vague about it: in the "years of lead" in Italy it was mostly the far left that was engagi

by Udik 6y ago

Just to make a minor point clear, since it seems the article is a bit vague about it: in the "years of lead" in Italy it was mostly the far left that was engaging in terrorism and political violence. Just one sentence that seems a bit cavalier with history: "... the Italian Red Brigades have also pursued violent accelerationist campaigns in pursuit of social change." The Italian Red Brigades have kidnapped, kept prisoner for 2.5 months, subjected to a mock trial and finally executed the president of Italy's relative majority party of the time, the Christian Democrats. The body was left in the trunk of a parked car. You may call it a "violent accelerationist campaign in pursuit of social change", if you will.

AndrewBissell 6y ago
You may need to catch up on the news a bit, Steve Pieczenik of the U.S. State Department (common cover for CIA) admitted that he killed Aldo Moro to prevent him from divulging state secrets. https://www.ibtimes.co.uk/italy-accuses-us-envoy-steve-pieczenik-aldo-moro-murder-1474527 https://www.ibtimes.co.uk/italy-accuses-us-envoy-steve-piecz... I would imagine some of those secrets may have had to do with other incidents where the Red Brigade and other left wing groups were framed in false flag incidents as part of the Gladio strategy of tension. It's maybe noteworthy that the same Steve Pieczenik was pushing a larval version of the QAnon "deep state patriot" narrative in the leadup to the 2016 election: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ov5kvWSz5LM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ov5kvWSz5LM
- Udik 6y ago
  Ah, we have no shortage in Italy of people who claim to have been the kingpin of this or that plot central to the history of the nation. Whatever Pieczenik might have said there are most probably others who gave a different version (Italy's very outspoken president Cossiga, for example). Anyway, those who materially organised the kidnapping and executed the victim were communist militants- fighting against the... "imperialist state of the multi-national companies". Oh well. Maybe they were just 40 years ahead of their time :).
  - AndrewBissell 6y ago
    Has the Italian government found any of those other claims of responsibility credible enough to open an inquiry into them? I found this passage in the article I linked interesting too: > The request came as prosecutors demanded that a linked probe on allegations that two Italian intelligence agents were present at the site of Moro kidnapping be dismissed.
    - Udik 6y ago
      If you're familiar with the case you surely know that Romano Prodi, who was going to become minister of the Industry a few months later (and much later became Italy's prime minister), tipped the police about the possible location of Moro after having learned about it during a spiritic seance with other high-ranking politicians. Unfortunately the only word the ghosts communicated ("Gradoli") was taken to be the name of a small village (that was thoroughly searched with no results) and not that of the street of Rome, via Gradoli, where Moro was in fact kept hidden. This is to say that the layers of mysteries are so stacked one upon the other that I doubt there is anything resembling the truth beneath them. I don't doubt that there might have been pressures, schemings, and international interferences. In the end what remains undeniable is the stupidity and the conviction of those who materially kept him prisoner and killed him.

by Udik 6y ago

AndrewBissell 6y ago

You may need to catch up on the news a bit, Steve Pieczenik of the U.S. State Department (common cover for CIA) admitted that he killed Aldo Moro to prevent him from divulging state secrets. https://www.ibtimes.co.uk/italy-accuses-us-envoy-steve-pieczenik-aldo-moro-murder-1474527 https://www.ibtimes.co.uk/italy-accuses-us-envoy-steve-piecz... I would imagine some of those secrets may have had to do with other incidents where the Red Brigade and other left wing groups were framed in false flag incidents as part of the Gladio strategy of tension. It's maybe noteworthy that the same Steve Pieczenik was pushing a larval version of the QAnon "deep state patriot" narrative in the leadup to the 2016 election: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ov5kvWSz5LM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ov5kvWSz5LM

Udik 6y ago
Ah, we have no shortage in Italy of people who claim to have been the kingpin of this or that plot central to the history of the nation. Whatever Pieczenik might have said there are most probably others who gave a different version (Italy's very outspoken president Cossiga, for example). Anyway, those who materially organised the kidnapping and executed the victim were communist militants- fighting against the... "imperialist state of the multi-national companies". Oh well. Maybe they were just 40 years ahead of their time :).
- AndrewBissell 6y ago
  Has the Italian government found any of those other claims of responsibility credible enough to open an inquiry into them? I found this passage in the article I linked interesting too: > The request came as prosecutors demanded that a linked probe on allegations that two Italian intelligence agents were present at the site of Moro kidnapping be dismissed.
  - Udik 6y ago
    If you're familiar with the case you surely know that Romano Prodi, who was going to become minister of the Industry a few months later (and much later became Italy's prime minister), tipped the police about the possible location of Moro after having learned about it during a spiritic seance with other high-ranking politicians. Unfortunately the only word the ghosts communicated ("Gradoli") was taken to be the name of a small village (that was thoroughly searched with no results) and not that of the street of Rome, via Gradoli, where Moro was in fact kept hidden. This is to say that the layers of mysteries are so stacked one upon the other that I doubt there is anything resembling the truth beneath them. I don't doubt that there might have been pressures, schemings, and international interferences. In the end what remains undeniable is the stupidity and the conviction of those who materially kept him prisoner and killed him.